DARPA Urban Challenge Forum

DARPA Discussion Forum Closed

John Wiseman — Thu, 20 Dec 2007 16:14:00 PST

It looks like DARPA deactivated the Grand Challenge discussion forum a while back, hence the lack of new posts in the feed. I'll keep the feed URL going for a bit, but it too will eventually disappear.

Until next time,
John Wiseman

Will there be another Grand Challenge?

LeenSTL — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:14:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Will there be another Grand Challenge?

I saw some of that on the 2004 forum which was closed when the 2005 event kicked off. Nothing ever happened with it, probably due to the lack of funds. The 2004 forum might still be around in an archive.

There was also an attempt to do Pikes Peak, the Axion team actually did the entire 14 mile course in a demo run. That race was postponed for a year then abandoned.

Next Level Challenge

LeenSTL — Thu, 08 Nov 2007 10:06:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Next Level Challenge

Having entertainment commentators with technical backgrounds during the
event was fine and it worked, there wasn't anything like that in the
previous challenges.

Remote UGVs in the field first?

zonyl — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:05:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Technology:Remote UGVs in the field first?

So why exactly arent we doing remote UGV ground vehicles already? Can we not remote control a semi carrying supplies in Iraq from Utah? I would think this would be the first step already taken towards full autonomous operation.

Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

Tyler Folsom — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 12:04:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Technology:Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

Maurice is right. The price is coming down and the future is not distant -- maybe three years. A major manufacturer of automotive sensors plans to drop their price from about $100,000 to $500 and put it in main-stream cars. I am looking to produce an autonomous vehicle for a total price of $10,000. See the story "Open-Source Warfare" in the November IEEE Spectrum about how the Internet helps Iraqi terrorists stay ahead of the US military. The same thing will happen with autonomous vehicles.

Torrent for the webcast

mailinator711 — Wed, 07 Nov 2007 07:26:00 GMT

Posted by: mailinator711 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Well I got it to work flawlessly after downloading a separate player and codec pack from free-codecs. I just installed Vista a week ago. I think VLC is using WMV11 codecs from the OS and the perhaps Vista DRM stops playback. Awesomeness.

Thanks zonyl for everything. You've gone above and beyond.

Will there be another Grand Challenge?

zonyl — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 11:56:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Miscellaneous:Will there be another Grand Challenge?

I seem to remember some discussion after the last challenge claiming that there was a commercial entity interested in doing their own automated vehicle competition for "entertainment" and prize money.

Anyone remember who / what that was?

[Edited on 11/6/2007]

Next Level Challenge

zonyl — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 11:51:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Next Level Challenge

Dr. Tether was claiming in his speech that the intent was to foster creativity and innovation in the technology. He also noted that DARPA was not going to pursue this technology beyond what it does for the events.

Im not a social econ / poly sci major, but putting on a better show would certainly not hurt the event or its claimed objective. Besides, I thought Jamie and Grant are entertainers, not military analysts.

Torrent for the webcast

zonyl — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 11:44:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Thats odd. It plays and seeks fine for me in Mplayer (linux). I dont know much about how windows deals with media nowadays.

$ mplayer DARPA.Urban.Challenge.Final.Event.avi

Playing DARPA.Urban.Challenge.Final.Event.avi.
ASF file format detected.
VIDEO: [WMV1] 320x240 24bpp 15.000 fps 0.0 kbps ( 0.0 kbyte/s)
Clip info:
name: DARPA Urban Challenge
author: DARPA
copyright: 2007
comments: For more information about the DARPA Urban Challenge, please visit www.GrandChallenge.org
xscreensaver_disable: Could not find XScreenSaver window.
GNOME screensaver disabled
========================================= =================================
Opening video decoder: [ffmpeg] FFmpeg's libavcodec codec family
Selected video codec: [ffwmv1] vfm: ffmpeg (FFmpeg M$ WMV1/WMV7)
========================================= =================================
========================================= =================================
Forced audio codec: mad
Opening audio decoder: [ffmpeg] FFmpeg/libavcodec audio decoders
AUDIO: 8000 Hz, 1 ch, s16le, 8.0 kbit/6.25% (ratio: 1000->16000)
Selected audio codec: [ffwmav2] afm: ffmpeg (DivX audio v2 (FFmpeg))
========================================= =================================
AO: [alsa] 48000Hz 1ch s16le (2 bytes per sample)
Starting playback...

changing the rules mid event?

zonyl — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 11:39:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

Joe, I have to ask. Do you feel that any of the teams that were not selected for the final race would have come close to beating the three finalists? If not, then what more did you expect?

Torrent for the webcast

RetypePassword — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 06:58:00 GMT

Posted by: RetypePassword to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Yeah; rename it .wmv and play it in Windows Media Player... It won't play in VLC. I had to do that for it to work on mac and windows. For linux, just playing it with mplayer will work. Seeking doesn't work no matter what, it seems.

Next Level Challenge

LeenSTL — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 03:48:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Next Level Challenge

DARPA selects the requirements based on what they think the military could realistically use, not on the perceived entertainment value of the event.

Will there be another Grand Challenge?

LeenSTL — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 03:44:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Will there be another Grand Challenge?

Look for the next competition on the moon, but it isn't being sponsored by DARPA.

changing the rules mid event?

LeenSTL — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 03:39:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

Wait a sec Joe, you're contradicting yourself, you said "no sour grapes". Your wife's team didn't make the cut, get over it.

Torrent for the webcast

mailinator711 — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 02:47:00 GMT

Posted by: mailinator711 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

First, thanks to zonyl for recording and sharing the video.

Second, does anyone know how to play the video? I can get a video feed on VLC, with no seeking capabilities. But, the audio is choppy and incoherent... Can someone tell me how to get the video to play?

Will there be another Grand Challenge?

Robo_Mallard — Tue, 06 Nov 2007 02:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Robo_Mallard to Miscellaneous:Will there be another Grand Challenge?

Will there be another Grand Challenge or is 2007's the last one DARPA will hold? If it isn't the last one, when is the next one planned, what will the challenge be, what will the prizes be, and where will it be held?

As for the next challenge, how about DARPA taking it up a notch and giving the autonomous vehicles a realistic "hot" combat scenario. Roadside explosions from IEDs blowing up a convoy lead vehicle (or simulated one and not the contestant vehicles), hostiles trying to highjack them, hostiles trying to ram them with trucks, being shot at by hostiles, and so forth.

Torrent for the webcast

RetypePassword — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 11:59:00 GMT

Posted by: RetypePassword to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Thanks again, zonyl. I've finished downloading it --- along with a bunch of other people. XD. 31 new seeds in less than five minutes. Anyhow, would you care to tell me how you got the stream dumped to a file, pray tell?

[Edited on 11/6/2007]

Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

zonyl — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 07:11:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Technology:Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

Posted by: AKCline

Firstly, I am hoping someone can explain to me how robot
cars will save lives in military situations. I understand the arguments about
reducing traffic fatalities in civilian situations but I cannot understand the
claim regarding military lives.
------------

From what I understand from friends overseas in Iraq, most of our soldiers that are kidnapped / killed are from lightly armored convoys (we dont run tanks and apache's along side our spare parts / food shipments). A majority of these deaths involve soldiers driving in vehicles.

DARPA is trying to jump-start technology that reduces the number of humans required to drive vehicles in dangerous situations. If a roadside bomb detonates a robot vehicle carrying medicine we are out some money, not a human life.

In the convoys that absolutely require humans, autonomous cars can "lead" the group and take the roadside bomb blast ahead of everyone else.

[Edited on 11/6/2007]

Torrent for the webcast

Pascal — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 04:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Pascal to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Thanks a lot Zonyl. I'm downloading it.

Pascal

Torrent for the webcast

quux — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 03:13:00 GMT

Posted by: quux to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

Awesome! Thanks!

changing the rules mid event?

honest joe — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 02:35:00 GMT

Posted by: honest joe to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

exactly. almost good enough, all of the teams fielded vehicles that were almost good enough, it is called research and development. non of the vehicles will ever go into production as is, each is or was a prototype, more reasearch is needed more development required. that was the point of the exercise as i read it, to stimulate the reaserch and development of uav.

as my wife says it, "there were some scary vehicles out there, our did good but with glitches even if we completed all the courses"

if the point was to stimulate development and reasearch why change the rules? this is only going to make teams / research facilities feel that entering is pointless. so dont enter

will that feeling provide the best equipment for armed forces around the world in the next ten years? the timescale for research to full deployment of any concept is what? at the end of compotition? i am not sure on that!

this is not a game i totaly agree

this is serious stuff millions of lives and dollers are at stake
its not a game were its your ball so its your rules
try changing the rules at half time in a fifa match!
it will lead to confusion and resentment. and that is what has happened here.

Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

maurice — Mon, 05 Nov 2007 02:02:00 GMT

Posted by: maurice to Technology:Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

changing the rules mid event?

Score5150 — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 12:24:00 GMT

Posted by: Score5150 to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

I have to agree with LeenSTL this was not a game of horseshoes, having participated today for more then seven hours with the bots as a traffic vehicle driver you get a real taste of the what ifs when you are face to face with a vehicle like Terramax, I had to take evasive action to keep from getting run over today.
That is the reality of the judgements made by DARPA this week keeping this event as realistic and as safe as possible, it would be impossible for DARPA to please everyone, as for me I am very happy in the way they handled the teams that were almost good enough.

Ken

Next Level Challenge

spacev — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 12:13:00 GMT

Posted by: spacev to Urban Challenge Final Event:Next Level Challenge

It was a great event but the online coverage was sub par. The high bandwidth video was somwhat jerky and the sound seemed slow too.

I wish there had been a video stream per bot from the chase vehicle. In such a state of the art event, that should be possible.
The map tracking and status board where also not updated for me during the race.

I wonder what the next level from here is? I would like to see:

- Traffic lights (normal + yellow/red blinking)
- Cars in the parking lot, at least the spot to be parked in has to be surrounded by cars or concrete barriers.
- Parking lot pedestrians (bots)
- Fewer to no GPS coordinates(maybe only start/finish), instead use road names, destinations etc....
- More human traffic

Other Interesting Info

Anna Graham — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 10:08:00 GMT

Posted by: Anna Graham to Urban Challenge Final Event:Other Interesting Info

Other Final Event stats that would be interesting to see:
- actual distance travelled by each bot (*should* be the same, but maybe some tried alt routes at jams),
- speed on each segment of roadway (full list on every pass).
- maximum speed on each segment.
- overlay of all teams positions in absolute time on the course - animated map.

Results

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 08:33:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Results

1st - Boss
2nd - Junior
3rd - Odin

Boss was a great in the intersections

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 07:55:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Boss was a great in the intersections

Boss definitely was the best vehicle at the intersections. After they announced the winners I went back to the footage and didnt really notice how quick and confident it moved through them.

Good Job Team Tartan!!

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 07:21:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Im getting swarmed, so it may be a little slow.. Hopefully other folks chunks will start relieving the pressure.
Currently there are 10 leechers.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

RetypePassword — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 07:19:00 GMT

Posted by: RetypePassword to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Hmm... It's not working for me... :-( Never mind. It is.

[Edited on 11/4/2007]

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 07:17:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Someone is downloading it now, so it must be working ;)

Torrent for the webcast

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 07:16:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Torrent for the webcast

I put a torrent for the webcast out on the internet (Let me know if this is not legal?) I missed a few minutes in the beginning cause the webcast server kept booting me, but recorded solid till the end.

http://thepiratebay.org/tor/3873219/DARPA _Urban_Challenge_Final_Event

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 06:58:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Try:
http://thepiratebay.org/user/zonyl

Thanks for the tips. This is the first time I have tried to upload a torrent. KTorrent claims it is seeding, but dont see it on the PB website.. Let me know if it isnt working.

(DARPA if the webcast is illegal to post, let me know and ill gladly take it down)

[Edited on 11/4/2007]

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Comprox — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 06:30:00 GMT

Posted by: Comprox to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

What about other bit torrent sites? thepiratebay or mininova for example?

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

RetypePassword — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 06:29:00 GMT

Posted by: RetypePassword to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Split it and upload it to mediafire. Mediafire allows 100 MB/file, so... because you're probably using linux, I'd do: split --bytes=100m [filename]

Edit: Actually, I'd recommend you split it to 99m, because they might calculate megabytes differently.

[Edited on 11/4/2007]

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 06:24:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

I tried with them but they block free mail services for account creation. Not exactly going to post this under my real email <just in case>

The file is 471MB, does anyone have any ideas?

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

theinfonaut — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 04:47:00 GMT

Posted by: theinfonaut to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

Nice, also a good idea.

Thanks for the suggestions, I'm sure this will all come in handy next year!
(The Urban Challange was fantastic fun to watch yesterday, I'm glad we made it out!)

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Comprox — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 02:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Comprox to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Yes, please let us know when a link goes up. I just checked and could not find anything.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

RetypePassword — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 01:38:00 GMT

Posted by: RetypePassword to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

When you do get it on isohunt, could you post the link? Thanks.

Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

Adak — Sun, 04 Nov 2007 01:07:00 GMT

Posted by: Adak to Technology:Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

If you recall from Desert Storm, we had the Revolutionary Guard pinned by our advancing tanks, if they had just kept going. Unfortunately, they stopped for some much needed sleep, and the RG and their supplies, slipped away. Many could not be found again. Schwartzkopf had a fit! :)

If some of those tanks had been robotically controlled, then the RG would have indeed been captured/killed. No sleep needed.

No, I don't believe it will be cheap, and I don't believe it will be commonly available to both sides. You're looking at $300,000 worth
of equipment on those cars. Sure it will come down, but not to the point where every Iraqi insurgent who wants one will be able to
afford it - let alone have the expertise to set it up and program it.

What prevents such catastrophes? Same thing that now prevents suicide bombers driving trucks with bombs in them into target-rich environments. I don't
see a lot of difference between the bot driving, and the suicidal human who puts a rope on the steering wheel and a weight on the gas pedal, after lining it up
right for the target.

Either way, the truck has to be stopped by something besides just sa fire, which would kill the driver.

Ben Franklin

Anna Graham — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 11:55:00 GMT

Posted by: Anna Graham to Urban Challenge Final Event:Ben Franklin

Looks to me like Benny didn't want to violate the traffic law of crossing a solid double-line.
They should have properly marked the road if obeying the law is so paramount.

Untested at the Qualifiers

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 11:01:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Untested at the Qualifiers

I doubt that there will be any jamming in this scenario. It is true that the bots have only seen other sensor-less vehicles, I doubt that the sensors would intefere with each other due to the angles where they are pointing.

It seems that team Dad is a winner already based on the sales of their new lidars!

Untested at the Qualifiers

Anna Graham — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 10:07:00 GMT

Posted by: Anna Graham to Urban Challenge Final Event:Untested at the Qualifiers

I am most interested in how these bots will fare when they pass eachother on the course.
In prior events and at the UC Qualifiers, the bots were operating on their own.
They were the only bot in the area. None of the stunt cars had active sensors, AFAIK.
Does anyone know if the active sensors will function in the presence of other sensors?
Are any of the teams operating a completely passive solution like Team DAD in 2004?
Ironically, it is the Team DAD folks who have the "noisiest" sensor out now that many teams are using.
Will DARPA include "jamming/confusing" LIDAR signals on the course today?
I think the next Challenge should require silent/passive solutions so that autonomous vehicles in unfriendly environments are not broadcasting their presence.

Results

DaveB — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:58:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Urban Challenge Final Event:Results

Both Wired and TG Daily agree the results won't be known until the trophies are handed out, tomorrow at 10:00 am, PST (that's Pacific STANDARD Time, as we go off daylight saving time at 2:00 am -- which then becomes 1:00 am)

Statistics I'd love to see posted

heflin — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:52:00 GMT

Posted by: heflin to Urban Challenge Final Event:Statistics I'd love to see posted

For *EACH* vehicle : where/which_situation it performed best & worst

Statistics I'd love to see posted

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:48:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Statistics I'd love to see posted

Usually DARPA has the teams post technical papers describing their HW & SW, I know they are available for the previous events. You'll find most of what you're looking for in those.

Results

zonyl — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:47:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Results

Was this announced anywhere? At the end of the webcast they said results on Sunday.

Results

halfchild — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:05:00 GMT

Posted by: halfchild to Urban Challenge Final Event:Results

victor tango wins!!!!!!

Congrats Hokies and Congrats to TORC!!!!!

Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

AKCline — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 09:05:00 GMT

Posted by: AKCline to Technology:Save Lives? What about a robot car with a bomb?

Firstly, I am hoping someone can explain to me how robot
cars will save lives in military situations. I understand the arguments about
reducing traffic fatalities in civilian situations but I cannot understand the
claim regarding military lives.
I am assuming that the technology will be both public and
cheap. In a military situation both sides will have access to it and so I see
no net benefit.
Furthermore, as has been seen in Iraq, significant civilian
casualties can be caused by bombs located in cars with suicidal drivers. With
robot technology a suicidal driver isn’t even required. A robot car laden with
explosives could drive right up next to the Rose Parade or the New Year’s Eve crowd
at Times Square.
Can someone please explain what will prevent such
catastrophes?

Results

parker — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 08:41:00 GMT

Posted by: parker to Urban Challenge Final Event:Results

Does anyone know when/if results will be posted? I watched the whole event (stopping after the sixth car - alma mater Cornell - crossed the line because I had to go to dinner) but I feel like I have been left hanging. If they said the results, does anyone know them? Thanks a lot!

~Parker

Statistics I'd love to see posted

BigRedAlum96 — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 08:26:00 GMT

Posted by: BigRedAlum96 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Statistics I'd love to see posted

Unless they are considered confidential for some reason, it would be fun to see some followup postings to summarize statistics (maybe in one table offering easy side-by-side comparisons) about the entrants in the following areas broken down by vehicle and grouped by vehicles that 1) finished 2) made the finals 3) entered the qualtifying event

1) total price of vehicle and all components used (onboard)
2) number of sensors of each various type
3) number of CPUs, RAM, and persistent storage capacity
4) which OS platform? (why did skynet have to stop and "recycle" so many times? are they running windows?)
5) what is their programming "stack"? (how many custom drivers to interface to the sensors/actuators, application server & number of instances if used, database type and number of instances if used, messaging middleware if used, programming language, etc)
6) some classification of their algorithms (how distributed are they, computational distance (modules) between sensing and acting, which modules are using the most compute power, degree of self-learning enabled during the competition, summary of approaches to which data can be ignored or prioritized in what order)
7) which part of their software module does each team feel they would focus on most if given more time to prepare?

Great event, thanks to everybody who participated.
-LW

Aside from collisions, what else knocked teams out of the NQE?

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 08:18:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to National Qualification Event:Aside from collisions, what else knocked teams out of the NQE?

Good job to all of the teams that tried, and especially to those that made it to the NQE and beyond. For those that did not make it to the finals, what did your bot lose points on at the NQE?

Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 08:03:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

Thanks, there is an extra space in the link for some reason, but I can't seem to create an id there anyway, if you have an id there please give them a high five post for a job well done.

Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

zonyl — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:39:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

http://community.discovery.com/eve/forums /a/cfrm/f/2991937776

Well Done and Inspiring

BigRedAlum96 — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:38:00 GMT

Posted by: BigRedAlum96 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Well Done and Inspiring

OK last comment for now-- I meant US engineering college Computer Science curriculums have been exceedingly boring.

I speak from experience at Cornell in the early 90s when they bored me right out of the program into economics-- I take responsibility for that too and have many fond memories and successes to celebrate anyway, but days like today while I watch these robots wish I would have stuck it out to get a PHD and have more chances to participate in design projects like this instead of building financial applications...

In my case "youth is wasted on the young" -- kids don't sell yourselves short and stick with your dreams no matter how hard those professors try to turn you off with classes that don't seem to have any practical application! There's room for both the students and the curriculums to step up and keep the US economy competitive and stop the offshoring of all engineering work from becoming a self-fulfilling prophecy.

-LW

Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:27:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Mythbusters need to hear some kudos if they have a forum

I enjoyed the commentary so much that I am going to make sure to send the Mythbusters a note on their forum if they have one. Trust me, it's rare to hear technical chat that is even mildly accurate, just view some of the team videos done by TV interviewers. They will say things like "the robot is controlled by the USB drive", that is almost an exact quote. Besides, if Jamie hasn't seen it he can at least figure out how it would be done, so kudos to DARPA for going with the Mythbusters, and kudos to the Mythbusters for being cool.

Well Done and Inspiring

BigRedAlum96 — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:24:00 GMT

Posted by: BigRedAlum96 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Well Done and Inspiring

- I'm excited to see all the multicore solutions (40, 30, 9 mac-mini's,
etc) being demonstrated. I feel the current generation of programmers
(including myself) in the business world right now are not prepared
well enough to leverage the coming power of dozens or thousands of
simulatenous threads distributed across emerging compute grids. I hope that this race will drive multicore
programming into the mainstream faster and help increase the skillset of programmers everywhere.

- I look forward to Numenta's furthering of their HTM capabilities and how their predictive memory model will be applied to influence future iterations of competitions like this.

- I'm very impressed by the teams and the finishers, I can imagine they are all salivating for more computing power to allow exponential levels of sophistication in their next entries. I can't tell you how excited I am to see history in the making and the development of ever more capable machines.

- Cheers to all the teams, to DARPA for helping inspire the US to grow/maintain its technology expertise to keep our economy competitive, and especially to my alma mater's entry "Skynet" for being among the finishers. (Go Big Red!)

Great event for the teams, current and future innovators, the US, the world!
Celebrate the day
-LW

Well Done and Inspiring

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:20:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Well Done and Inspiring

It's a hot topic in schools everywhere, even in the community college where I teach there is interest in providing some robotics orientation. Budgets are not huge but there will be some exposure at least. Every teacher in every programming and engineering class should be making sure their students are exposed to these competitions.

Well Done and Inspiring

BigRedAlum96 — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:14:00 GMT

Posted by: BigRedAlum96 to Urban Challenge Final Event:Well Done and Inspiring

I'm sitting in Seattle this morning and have been glued to the live web feed for over 6 hours with barely a break...

Main areas I'm pondering:
- How long until the next round and ever more realistic environment? (victorville was less than suburban, let alone urban. Where are the buses, streetcars, parked cars along the roadway, pedestrians crossing streets, bicycles in traffic lanes, etc?)
- I can only hope that all the lazy high school or younger kids out there in the USA get off the couch and video games and break out their mathbooks! Software design is fun and you won't get a shot to play with these kinds of robotic "toys" unless you pay attention, work hard in school, and go find a good engineering program for college. You are not entitled to the same quality of life your parents had... you have to go earn it yourself and be competitive in a global economy!
- I hope that US engineering colleges are waking up to the fact that your curriculums have been exceedingly boring for too many years and contribute to the shortage of enrollments and grads. Its going to be the real world applications and practical implementations of the theory like this challenge that we need to raise interest and increase enrollments again.

<more to come next post I'm cut off on character limits>

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:13:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

head back towards Nevada, tourist area rates are always less.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Pascal — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Pascal to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Zonyl,

Thanks in advance!

changing the rules mid event?

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:11:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

Imagine if our troops lives were at stake, should they settle for robots that almost work but end up running over the troops? This was not a game of horseshoes, so teams that were almost good enough were not in the finals.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:04:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

LeenSTL — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 07:01:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Having the Mythbusters team was a great idea, they were often correct on technical concepts. Few in the mainsteam media could even understand the concepts much less explain them.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Pascal — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 06:42:00 GMT

Posted by: Pascal to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Zonyl,
unfortunately, I was unable to see the webcast with my computer (a problem of plug-in with my Firefox browser under Linux).
I'm so sad not to see any images from the event...

Could it be possible for me to download the video you've recorded?

Thanks.

Pascal

Congrats!

Kyle — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 06:10:00 GMT

Posted by: Kyle to Urban Challenge Final Event:Congrats!

>Inspires me to try and compete at the next event.

These teams are doing amazing things. It would be awesome to be working on this.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

zonyl — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 05:54:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

It was available on the web. I was able to watch live on Linux and record the event as well. Very entertaining with the Mythbusters as hosts.

Thanks DARPA for providing the coverage on the web!

Congrats!

zonyl — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 05:52:00 GMT

Posted by: zonyl to Urban Challenge Final Event:Congrats!

Yes, well done all!! Very entertaining day watching the event. Inspires me to try and compete at the next event.

Congrats!

Gulag — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 05:45:00 GMT

Posted by: Gulag to Urban Challenge Final Event:Congrats!

Congratulations to all the teams completing the course. No matter the winner, the results speak for themselves.

Status Board Issue?

DaveB — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 04:32:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

Just read Johnathon's third entry, and by golly that link can download High -Bandwidth video.

Also, I see the Board has been updated to show 5 vehicles finishing Mission 2

Status Board Issue?

DaveB — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 04:22:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

Then again, it's now 1:10pm, PDT, and the board still shows only 3 vehicles having finished Mission 2, whereas all 6 remaining vehicles finished by about 1:00 pm. Maybe the secretary who puts n the check marks went on coffee break.

Still no bots shown oh the Course Map

Status Board Issue?

DaveB — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 04:00:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

OK. They've finally gotten some data posted on the Status Board, at abouit 3:50 EDT, or 12:50 pm, PDT

Status Board Issue?

Jonathan Anderson — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 03:54:00 GMT

Posted by: Jonathan Anderson to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

Apparently there is a confusion between the grandchallenge and darpa.mil sites.

If you go to http://www.grandchallenge.org/darpauc07/w atchtherace/

Things work better...

JA

Status Board Issue?

Jonathan Anderson — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 03:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Jonathan Anderson to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

In case anyone's paying attention, note that the audio level on the low-bandwidth live video is very low.

JA

Status Board Issue?

Jonathan Anderson — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 03:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Jonathan Anderson to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

DaveB:

Verify exact same experience, WinXP and Mac OS X (10.4). Low-bandwidth video feed works fine via Flip4Mac WMV plugin.

JA

Status Board Issue?

DaveB — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 02:34:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

I get an empty Status Board, a Tracking Map with no vehicles, and nothing on High-Bandwidth Video.

Fortunately, the Low-Bandwidth Video works, except that it took me about an hour to give up on high bandwidth.

I'm trying with two computers running the latest XP updates, and one running Wn 98.

If anyone is getting any of these functions, please let us know. In the last challenge, the status board started working about a quarter way through the event. It's too late for that, but maybe they'll get it going by half way through this one.

Status Board Issue?

JeffS — Sat, 03 Nov 2007 02:02:00 GMT

Posted by: JeffS to Miscellaneous:Status Board Issue?

Anyone experiencing difficulties with status board updates? I've installed the latest Flash plugins, but I still get an empty board. Any suggestions? Thanks! : )

G G G Gunit!!!

DarpaGhad — Fri, 02 Nov 2007 12:13:00 GMT

Posted by: DarpaGhad to Vendor/Suppliers:G G G Gunit!!!

DICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHDICK MUNCHV

Darpa

DarpaGhad — Fri, 02 Nov 2007 12:12:00 GMT

Posted by: DarpaGhad to Vendor/Suppliers:Darpa

i are darpa going chalgange, me need see fun cool eksiting evnt cuzx i luvs the eksitement of adrenilenenenenen
me fvrite atomoble are stanly

changing the rules mid event?

DaveB — Fri, 02 Nov 2007 10:29:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

H. Joe, I agree they seem to change the rules more than necessary, but they DO have that right, and from what we've seen on YouTube and TGDaily a lot of vehicles needed to be eliminated.

What's worse is that REAL speed limits are no more clear than those on most highways. In the last Challenge, it was apparent that some vehicles were getting away with going faster than the mission data file allowed. In fact, if CMU had allowed their backup vehicle to go faster, they might have won (their primary entry had problems that prevented it from attaining its target speed).

Maybe DARPA has already said in one of the meetings, that ANY speeds in excesss of the limit will be cause for elimination, but if not, they SHOULD, and should enforce it. If all entries behave, and observe the speed limits, then the two million dollars may be won by the entry with the fastest acceleration and stopping. Hmmmmm

In my opinion, the worst rule change was when they announced, for the first Grand Challenge, that the field would be pared down to 20 cars before the final test. Up to that point, it was supposed to be a real "race", open to all comers, so that was the first introduction of their subjective evaluation being used to eliminate teams. Since then, it's always been clear that their opinions would be used to decide who gets to race.

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

theinfonaut — Fri, 02 Nov 2007 05:56:00 GMT

Posted by: theinfonaut to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

Oh, good idea! Flying to Vegas would be cheaper then LAX too. It looks like we're going to drive down through the night and save ourselves from a night at a hotel (time to go buy a case of redbull).

Perhaps next year we'll plan a bit more. ;)

Now the next fun challange will be finding a place to crashwith 4 people for Saturday night. Any more smart ideas?

changing the rules mid event?

Gulag — Thu, 01 Nov 2007 08:07:00 GMT

Posted by: Gulag to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

I am not convinced that any rule changes occurred during the selection process. At first glance, it did appear to be somewhat arbitrary. The early teams that were eliminated consistently failed to demonstrate capabilities or showed unsafe behavior. Obviously, DARPA didn't want to put teams into the race that would potentially cause a more capable team to be eliminated due to a collision. Unfortunately, the scoring process was not and will probably never be published so it appears biased. Everyone was given an even slate of qualifying runs at the beginning.

As for the final competitor count, DARPA has always stated that they would field up to 20 teams. Selecting fewer is inline with everything that has been stated throughout the program.

DARPA did setup courses that violated many of the stated rules. The start chutes on Area B were significantly less than the 1 meter clearance on all sides of the vehicle based on the stated maximum vehicle width. Likewise, the setup on Area A was a joke initially with a concrete barrier on a 12 ft lane. Given a mandatory clearance of 1 meter on both sides of a vehicle, the 12 ft lane wasn't really plausible for vehicles that were near the maximum vehicle width.

Obviously, they were looking for human behavior and not rule rollowing.

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

LeenSTL — Thu, 01 Nov 2007 07:15:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

Go in the night before and drive out from Vegas, maybe you'd get a tourist rate on the flight.

changing the rules mid event?

honest joe — Thu, 01 Nov 2007 03:33:00 GMT

Posted by: honest joe to Rules:changing the rules mid event?

While many teams attended the event it seems that the darpa directors were haphazard and random in the process of selection. Once again dod proves that they cant act fairly.

This is going to have a nock on effect, next time teams will not enter as the randomization of results is going to make the effort pointless.

Why o why at the last minute change finalists from 20 to 12?

Did they want to get a round of golf in before going back to work?

Sorry but I think there is some stupidity here. When you publish rules and guidelines even the judges have to follow them.

sour grapes nope i am not in any team.

my wife is but then she gets to come home early so i win anyway two weeks without her is long enough

HELP Please Post Links to Videos

DaveB — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 04:47:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Media:HELP Please Post Links to Videos

DARPA has now posted info on satellite feeds, and planned webcast, at the top of the home page:
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/index .asp

I haven't yet gotton my old dish going, so if any of you smart guys, such as Carnigie Mellon U, could webcast what's going out now, on the NQE, a lot of us would appreciate it (assuming it's on-going, rather than a short event).

Also note that my copy of IE (not the latest version), can view the videos at tgdaily.com You just have to click on the right-arrow "Play" button that comes up in the middle of the screen.

HELP Please Post Links to Videos

DaveB — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 03:41:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Media:HELP Please Post Links to Videos

Another YouTube search, which finds a few videos, not caught by the above link:

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=+%2 2urban+challenge%22&so=1&num=30

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

DaveB — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 03:13:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

Yeah. The sad part is that it's being held at the Southern California International Airport (or Southern California Logistics Airport), but no airlines seem to fly there.

You could get a bit closer by flying to Ontario or Riverside, but consider just renting a car at LAX.

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

theinfonaut — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 02:28:00 GMT

Posted by: theinfonaut to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

Partially answering my own question (and for the benefit of anyone else who might want to know):
http://maps.google.com/maps?f=d&hl=en &geocode=&time=&date=&tty pe=&saddr=lax&daddr=vcv&sll=3 6.156895,-119.88529&sspn=3.853808,8.0 74951&ie=UTF8&z=10&om=1

It's a hundred miles or so between LAX and the event grounds. Yowser, that's no taxi ride.

How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

theinfonaut — Wed, 31 Oct 2007 01:54:00 GMT

Posted by: theinfonaut to Miscellaneous:How can I get from LAX to the Urban Challange event on Saturday?

I'm thinking of flying into LA on Saturday morning, but I've never been to LAX or LA before, and I'm not clear on how far the event is from the airport. Does anyone know if it will be very difficult, if there are any shuttles, or anyone else flying in who might have a ride?
Thanks!

HELP Please Post Links to Videos

not5150 — Mon, 29 Oct 2007 08:58:00 GMT

Posted by: not5150 to Media:HELP Please Post Links to Videos

We (tgdaily.com) have posted up at least 15 videos so far. Mostly crashes unfortunately :)

Use Firefox to view the pages as our webmaster seems to be asleep at the switch - website change has apparently made all the videos appear blank in IE.

Humphrey Cheung
Senior Editor TGDaily.com

HELP Please Post Links to Videos

DaveB — Sat, 27 Oct 2007 03:06:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Media:HELP Please Post Links to Videos

Aha! I see there are now a couple E-stop and preliminary runs on YouTube, found using the link on Team Gator Nation's "The Players" page:

http://video.google.com/videosearch?q=dar pa%2Bchallenge&num=10&so=1&st art=0

HELP Please Post Links to Videos

DaveB — Sat, 27 Oct 2007 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Media:HELP Please Post Links to Videos

Help! Since DARPA says it won't post live streaming video until the final event, and hasn't yet posted any video clips, we fans need you teams and media to provide some clips, and post links to them here.

Even E-stop tests or other boring clips of the vehicles moving (or stopping) will help us decide who to root for.

Thanks a million for anything you might post.

Commercialization

Tyler Folsom — Fri, 19 Oct 2007 05:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Teaming:Commercialization

A group of people from four Grand Challenge teams has formed a company to commercialize autonomous vehicle technology. We are adressing the civilian non-automotive market. Our vision statement is on www.cogneta.com. We are looking to team with others who can supply software and hardware solutions. I will be in Victorville Oct 25 - 28. My cell phone is 206-679-1196.

Televison?

ptrep — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 03:55:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Media:Televison?

Discovery Science Channel has followed 10 teams since the site visits. They will be broadcasting 6 episodes in February realted to the DARPA Urban Challenge.

Televison?

creamysbrianna — Mon, 08 Oct 2007 12:19:00 GMT

Posted by: creamysbrianna to Media:Televison?

Will there be any Television productions being made of the race for brodcast as a documentary or 1-hour television show to be brodcast in the United States?

I would love to see such a documentary or television show since I am unable to attend the race in person.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

DaveB — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 10:26:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Not likely, Dan, as neither of the first two challenges were even broadcast live in the US.

During the first challenge, one of the colleges (Carnigie Mellon, I think) broadcast live on the internet, which worked out quite well.

During the second challenge, DARPA hired a company to provide live pictures and position data, which worked out very poorly.

In neither case did we learn what would be available untill the last minute (couple of days, actually).

The normal media seem to prefer editing a show for later broadcasting, possibly because they have no experience with this particular event, and each Challenge is different than the last.

Keep your fingers crossed in hope that SOMEone will do a webcast of this Challenge, and keep your eye on this forum, probably in the media or other thread since we hope to see the NQE, as well as the Final Event.

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

dankrusi — Fri, 05 Oct 2007 08:51:00 GMT

Posted by: dankrusi to Urban Challenge Final Event:Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Will the Finaly Event be available for viewing on Live TV in Europe?

Thanks,

Dan Krüsi

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Grasshopper — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 09:31:00 GMT

Posted by: Grasshopper to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Hey, sorry I haven't gotten back to anyone. Today was the first day I received an email to say anyone posted on here. Maybe the others went to spam or something. So, I'm still alive and willing to help out. Anyone still needing help shoot me an email at garmin_grasshopper@yahoo.com and let me know what you need, design plan, and milestone dates. Thanks.
-G-

finding VW parts

Muzio77 — Thu, 27 Sep 2007 05:53:00 GMT

Posted by: Muzio77 to Miscellaneous:finding VW parts

Have put a lot of time and money into restoring my 1967 Bug, and it hasn’t always been easy finding VW parts and accessories. Recently I was looking for a muffler and found a great deal at http://www.gex.com. Their prices are great and the service was excellent. I’ll definitely order from them again.

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 10:23:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

SGT Harland,

Interesting work you are doing.

I did not get to spend much time in Japan the several times I passed through there on my way to and from the ships I worked on. Marine Engineer (water trans.) 197.130-010 http://www.occupationalinfo.org/19/197130 010.html

Yes, my team can always use a hand. We have some interesting toys to play with that have been provided to us by our sponsors. We are working on automating an M-215 US Army supply truck to demonstate how it can be done.

Contact me directly for details.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187, (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/robotc luboftraversecitymi/
http://www.controleng.com/index.asp?layou t=blog&blog_id=1180000318

Technical Writer writing about your team.

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 10:08:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

SGT Harland,

I am intertested in all things technical. Always looking for things that I can use.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187, (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/robotc luboftraversecitymi/
http://www.controleng.com/index.asp?layou t=blog&blog_id=1180000318

Technical Writer writing about your team.

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 10:05:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

Richard,

I am paid $0.04 to $0.50 per published word depending on the prestige and circulation of the publication I am writing for.
I was unable to reach you directly off-line.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187, (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org
http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/robotc luboftraversecitymi/
http://www.controleng.com/index.asp?layou t=blog&blog_id=1180000318

OfbjectFX Corporation

Preston — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 04:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Vendor/Suppliers:OfbjectFX Corporation

Do you have any clients who have used this for mobile units that you can recomend? How about the integration into a website so the mobile units can get updated information from the web.

Preston - Educational Resources

RoboRealm - Free Robotic Machine Vision Software

Preston — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 03:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Vendor/Suppliers:RoboRealm - Free Robotic Machine Vision Software

What types of robots does your software support? Does it support off the shelf robots, modified existing robots or does it require custom built applications made just for your software.

There are possibly a gillion questions to ask so I will go to your site again and hope that you reply here so other members may know more about your product and maybe answer some of my own questions.

Preston - Educational Resources

Technical Writer writing about your team.

SGT Harland — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 02:22:00 GMT

Posted by: SGT Harland to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

Do you accept technical articles on new photography innovations? I have a few writers who have articles on photo lab and reproduction issues. Please let me know if you need any articles.

SGT Harland - Developer
Arlene Image innovations
DSP Architech
Dallas Texas
(719)290-5967
ceonit@frii.com
HDR Images

[Edited on 9/26/2007]

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

SGT Harland — Wed, 26 Sep 2007 02:13:00 GMT

Posted by: SGT Harland to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

I can maybe be of help. I do php, mySQL database and am ok at design. One of my latest conquests is at http://www.hdrjapan.com

The site is a image diary of historical Japan. I was stationed there for 6 years and loved the people, places and heratige. It was by far the most fantastic place I have ever lived in that it is the best place on earth to photograph. It's clean, alive and beautiful.

SGT Harland - Developer
Arlene Image innovations
DSP Architech
Dallas Texas
(719)290-5967
ceonit@frii.com

[Edited on 9/26/2007]

Technical Writer writing about your team.

Dr James — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Dr James to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

"My contract with Control Engineering Magazine allows me to write for other publications that are not competing for the same sponsors. Do you pay
your writers?"

How much do you get average for your articles? We are considering opening up a new section of our site for technical writing that applies to computers, including a sub-section for engineering.

Richard
Computer Hardware Engineer
Cisco Hardware

[Edited on 9/21/2007]

TrackB Video

Preston — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:22:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

Will there ever be a video released, for educational purposes of course? We have a service provider at http://www.shopricom who can make copies at our expense of the video if others want to have a copy of it also.

We have started a class of syncronized driving for television/movies and want to show students all aspects of driving.

http://www.adison.edu
Preston

Suspensions Unlimited

Preston — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 06:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Vendor/Suppliers:Suspensions Unlimited

Do you still sell suspensions? We are looking for a new supplier at the USAFA - I do upgrades at our detail shop: http://www.ni4detail.com

http://www.adison.edu
Preston

Wanting to work with a team

Sahyinepu — Fri, 21 Sep 2007 01:03:00 GMT

Posted by: Sahyinepu to Teaming:Wanting to work with a team

Hello. I am very late to all this I know. I am a college student in NW Houston area and am very interested in volunteering for a team. I am taking basic classes at a junior college as well as automechanics classes. I am a very high functioning autistic and very much want to go into the field of robotics/artificial intelligence. I am very excited about this event and would like to be as involved with it and those in the field as possible.

Buy Apple Iphone 8GB/Nokia N95 8GB/Motorola ROKR E8/Rizr Z8/Sony Ericsson P1/Eten glofiish X800/PS 3

coles — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:34:00 GMT

Posted by: coles to Technology:Buy Apple Iphone 8GB/Nokia N95 8GB/Motorola ROKR E8/Rizr Z8/Sony Ericsson P1/Eten glofiish X800/PS 3

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Buy Apple Iphone 8GB/Nokia N95 8GB/Motorola ROKR E8/Rizr Z8/Sony Ericsson P1/Eten glofiish X800/PS 3

coles — Thu, 20 Sep 2007 10:30:00 GMT

Posted by: coles to Miscellaneous:Buy Apple Iphone 8GB/Nokia N95 8GB/Motorola ROKR E8/Rizr Z8/Sony Ericsson P1/Eten glofiish X800/PS 3

huge selection of VW parts in stock and great service

Muzio77 — Wed, 19 Sep 2007 09:48:00 GMT

Posted by: Muzio77 to Miscellaneous: huge selection of VW parts in stock and great service

Needed an engine for my 2000 VW Golf. After checking out several websites I found exactly what I wanted at http://www.gex.com. The price was right, the service was great and they have a huge selection of VW parts in stock.

Technical Writer writing about your team.

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 06:29:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

Hi Preston,

The autonomousvehiclemfgrs newsgroup was overrun by spammers and has been shut down. I am still publishing info about teams and their sponsors several other places. My on-line column in Control Engineering Magazine http://www.controleng.com/index.asp?layou t=blog&blog_id=1180000318 is one of them. Control Engineering Magazine is the premeer technical journal for control engineers and automation engineers. Many teams have a PR person who sends out press releases every week. Please put me on your media distribution list for these press releases and whatever else you send out to the press.

My contract with Control Engineering Magazine allows me to write for other publications that are not competing for the same sponsors. Do you pay your writers?

Sounds like an interesting project.

What would you like my CE readers to know about your project?

Paul F. Grayson - Journalist
Control Engineering Magazine
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://www.controleng.com/index.asp?layou t=blog&blog_id=1180000318

Technical Writer writing about your team.

Preston — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 01:57:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

"Please put me on the distribution list for information you would like to see published" - Can you please elaborate on this comment.

Do you publish articles or written work? What type of work do you publish? We are developing http://www.adison.edu and her sister site http://www.nassonu.edu and not only do we need work to be published but we also want to publish good work.

Through 2008 we will be adding student collected databases of information for the internet to use and hope to do an article publishing system where we can show off unique articles/stories of great influence.

Any comments can help us greatly...

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Preston — Mon, 17 Sep 2007 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Preston to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

What type of work do you do? Software, Databases, etc. We are developing our .edu site at: http://www.adison.edu - and are in need of a person who can help with our student backend that we have in development. I look forward to and response from members of the forum who might have the right skills..

Questions about lane descriptions in the RNDF

Chef — Thu, 13 Sep 2007 09:29:00 GMT

Posted by: Chef to Rules:Questions about lane descriptions in the RNDF

Page 8 of the general rules says:

Driving in difficult off-road terrain is outside the scope of the program. Off-road
navigation in an unpaved area, travel along roads with potholes, and travel along a dirt
road are within scope.

Page 10 of the document about RNDF_MDF format says:

The <optional lane header> contains *SOME* or all of the following elements:
[...]
- left_boundary left_boundary (string ∈ {double_yellow, solid_yellow, solid_white, broken_white})
- right_boundary right_boundary (string∈ {double_yellow, solid_yellow, solid_white, broken_white})

FAQ C.4 states:

C.4. Will all the lane boundary lines listed in the RNDF actually be present in the physical world?
DARPA’s intent is for the RNDF lane boundary descriptors to match the actual physical lane markings on the ground. However, DARPA cannot ensure that this will be the case in all areas, and as such the RNDF shall take precedence over the physical ground markings in conflicting areas.

... and after having read the sample RNDF file, my questions are:

Are these statements true?
- DARPA intent is to have all the lane markings on the ground appear in the RNDF.
- If a line marking cannot be described in the RNDF (e.g. a broken yellow line, or line markings between entry and exit point) DARPA intent is to hide or delete them.
- If a section is unpaved, in the RNDF file lane boundary entries won't be present.

F/S:HTC x7500 AT $320USD,NOKIA N95 AT $250USD,NOKIA N97 AT $280USD,NOKIA N99 AT $300

thomas — Sat, 01 Sep 2007 05:49:00 GMT

Posted by: thomas to Technology:F/S:HTC x7500 AT $320USD,NOKIA N95 AT $250USD,NOKIA N97 AT $280USD,NOKIA N99 AT $300

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How about a 3d map of the course, in Real time?

Tidex Salevad — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:53:00 GMT

Posted by: Tidex Salevad to Vendor/Suppliers:How about a 3d map of the course, in Real time?

Hello Darpa teams!

My name is Eli, I'm the Business Development VP for Tidex Systems Ltd.
Our company has developed & patented a technology that builds a 3D map from a SINGLE STANDARD CAMERA on the move, in Real Time rates!
Yes! It means that your UGV could see and analyse depth from a standard camera view.

I'm sure you are aware of the potential for the DARPA teams who will utilize this patented technology into their UGVs.

Please feel free to email me to eli@tidex.co.il, or call (GMT+2), and we will find the best way to harness and integrate our technology to your
winning vehicle.

Regards,

Eli Steinberger
Business Development VP
Tidex Systems Ltd.
Cell: 972-54-254-4004

[Edited on 8/29/2007]

Attachments:

Get depth to your camera view.doc (23Kb)

Single Camera film to 3D model in Real time!!!

Tidex Salevad — Wed, 29 Aug 2007 12:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Tidex Salevad to Technology:Single Camera film to 3D model in Real time!!!

Hello Darpa teams!
My name is Eli, I'm the Business Development VP for Tidex Systems Ltd.

Our company has developed & patented a technology that builds a 3D map from a SINGLE STANDARD CAMERA on the move, in Real Time rates!
YES! It means that your UGV could see depth and analyse it, on the move!!

I'm sure you are aware of the potential for the DARPA teams who will utilize this patented technology into their UGVs.

Please feel free to email me to eli@tidexsystems.com, or call (GMT+2), and we will find the best way to harness and integrate our technology to your winning vehicle.

Regards,

Eli Steinberger
Business Development VP
Tidex Systems Ltd.
Cell: 972-54-254-4004

[Edited on 8/29/2007]

Attachments:

Hello Darpa teams.doc (23Kb)

Human-Robot Team for sale, lease, hire or trade

monster — Sat, 25 Aug 2007 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: monster to Miscellaneous:Human-Robot Team for sale, lease, hire or trade

Everything in the foreground of attached photo is for sale, lease or hire--Or maybe trade for an opportunity to earn an advanced degree.

Description:
1) Unit on the right: "JackBot" DGC 2005 Finalist. Lots of goodies, but would prefer not to part out.
2) Unit on the left: Me. Unfortunately, cannot be parted out. Must be fed daily. Will Travel.
3) Not visible: Lab, test site, spares, prototypes, computers, etc, etc.

Excluded by rule from the 2007 Urban Challenge. So, since the DGC2005, we've been focussing on multi-human, multi-UXV teaming and coordination, system enhancements, software cleanup, etc.
Website is out of date but here : www.monstermoto.com/jackbot

Seeking an opportunity to continue our work (about 16,000 hrs so far!) within a quality, funded setting. In addition to business opportunities, an academic or research setting would be welcome.

Thank you in advance for any ideas or pointers,
MonsterMoto
monstermoto@yahoo.com

[Edited on 8/25/2007]

Attachments:

jbot-comb.jpg (91Kb)

Buy unlocked nokia e90 at $320,nokia n95 at $300,HTC x7500 at $200,SE w960 at $200,SE w850i at $190

jezebel — Wed, 22 Aug 2007 08:16:00 GMT

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Spectators

DaveB — Wed, 15 Aug 2007 10:18:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to National Qualification Event:Spectators

Shawn

Spectators are welcome. NQE is 26 to 31, October. Challenge is 3, November. See third and fourth paragraphs on the Urban Challenge home page:
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/index .asp

They don't address which team will go when, or seating, but my guess based on previous challenges is that there will be a spectator area with seating, and that only press will be allowed near the course in other areas. Since they'l be doing the same course four times (as I recall), the start/finish area where the spactators are will likely be far and away the best place to watch from. I doubt they'll publish a schedule of start times for the NQE, but maybe. Anyway, who knows which teams will be the most interesting.

Hope you enjoy the events

Spectators

Shawn — Tue, 14 Aug 2007 01:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Shawn to National Qualification Event:Spectators

We live in Northern Virginia. My 7-year-old would dearly like to come and watch both the NQE and the Finals. Can anyone comment on the opportunities for spectators at the NQE?

Will there be seating or will we kinda jog around to witness different parts of the course?

Will a schedule be published listing what dates each team will complete in the NQE? If so, when will this schedule be available? It's a long trip for us and i'd like to make sure he's able to see his favorite teams compete in the NQE.

Thanks!

Need Support

jimbo — Thu, 09 Aug 2007 11:34:00 GMT

Posted by: jimbo to Sponsors:Need Support

Guys/Gals,

We have a simple gps gizmo that helps maintain speed.
We would donate one if you could use it.

Take a look:

http://www.gpscruise.wikispaces.com

-Jim Pruett

pharmacare

ewg — Mon, 06 Aug 2007 06:37:00 GMT

Posted by: ewg to Urban Challenge Final Event:pharmacare

Hopefully this will help you!
pharmacare

Ethics of this competition

Dan Frederiksen — Wed, 01 Aug 2007 08:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

ptrep, I address the team members. what other forum would be better?

Ethics of this competition

ptrep — Tue, 31 Jul 2007 09:25:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

I wish you had taken the hint when your thread was deleted last time. I am sure there is a forum somewhere else that would actually appreciate this kind of talk.

Ethics of this competition

Nick — Tue, 31 Jul 2007 09:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Nick to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

Dan, I hope that when you wake up in the morning, you realize how unique it is that you are allowed to have your opinion, voice it in public, and even debate it in public forums. It is an amazing privilege that far too many people take for granted. I can honestly say that I am very proud of any accomplishment that can help to protect our amazing men and women who sacrifice so we can have these privileges. In the words of Voltaire, "I do not agree with what you have to say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."

Ethics of this competition

Dan Frederiksen — Sun, 29 Jul 2007 02:26:00 GMT

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

Poll: Does this competition have ethically questionable implications

No, not at all

50%

1 Votes

Only if the technology falls into the wrong hands

0 Votes

Yes I have mixed feelings about it

0 Votes

Yes I would never take part in it

50%

1 Votes

Total Votes: 2

have any of you participants considered the ethical implication of taking part in this competition seeing as it is intended for war use. while some of you may tell yourself it is to save lives try to realize how it will only make it easier to sell warfare to the voters when none of their own die. try also to realize that it is for a group of people currently engaged in megacide in Iraq based on lies. can you honestly say you are without guilt if you aid them?

some of you might tell yourself that you know all this but take part anyway knowing you would never give the developed technology to military use. but if that is the case compare it to the power of the statement of not taking part in it or taking part but using a vehicle clearly marked as not for war use. if you are afraid to make such a statement have you not already surrendered to the service of the evil they represent?

although the analogy will not be flattering, it can however accurately be compared to n a z i engineering efforts. let it not be said that you didn't know.
(I write n a z i with spaces because this forum automatically censors that word. food for thought)

this message has been posted before but was deleted. again food for thought. if deleted again I will make a letter writing campaign to every last team taking part in this competition. I'm going to tell these people what you don't want them to know. where we go from there is up to you.

DGC III expected results

Seth Cabe — Fri, 27 Jul 2007 06:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Seth Cabe to Urban Challenge Final Event:DGC III expected results

I can only guess that level of success for this race will be somewhat similar, though probably better, than DGC 01. It is really all up to DARPA though. But Dr. Tether seemed to suggest this was not to be a cakewalk. If I were a betting man, I'd say this will be mostly a learning and testing experience for DGC IV, where someone might actually win. Just my 2 cents, I haven't been following this too closely lately.

Seth Cabe
860-808-6922
sethcabe@cabesystems.com
www.cabesystems.com (still VERY under construction ;))

Hello Ivar!

Seth Cabe — Fri, 27 Jul 2007 05:59:00 GMT

Posted by: Seth Cabe to Teaming:Hello Ivar!

Ivar, good to hear you are still in the action,

I really can't offer much, except advanced composites consulting (free) and manufacturing (materials cost). I just (this week) finished racing my latest team effort, a solar car (we are blue car on bottom left of page):

http://www.winstonsolar.org/challenge/

Here is a CNN piece, they show our blue car second (although the first reddish car to be shown was built largely using our consulting services!):

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/tech/200 7/07/18/watler.solar.powered.cars.kltv

Anyways, Ivar, good luck. I will try to be at the competition if I can. And if you think I can help, let me know (please).

Seth Cabe
860-808-6922
sethcabe@cabesystems.com
www.cabesystems.com (still VERY under construction ;))

Re: Seth Cabe, wanted to add a few things:

Seth Cabe — Fri, 27 Jul 2007 05:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Seth Cabe to Sponsors:Re: Seth Cabe, wanted to add a few things:

Here is the site for the race which we currently just tied for first in (unfortunately our motor controller limited our speed and so we had too much energy most of the time, having to disconnect our solar panel, while still tying the other team!):

http://www.winstonsolar.org/challenge/

We are the bluish car in the lower left hand of the cover page picture. MIT gave us their mold so we were pretty confident in our aerodynamics ;). Here is another pic of the car in action:

http://winstonsolar.tcu.edu/2007/photos/d ay7/photo/7day18.jpg

We did very well. We used Back Side Contact (BSC) cells which exceeded our every expectation. Anyways, I don't want to get too off topic. We have the capabilities to produce near-aerospace grade composite and reasonably well machined/welded titanium structures. I would be willing to entertain offers to produce or consult regarding our expertise on a non profit basis for DGC teams. I wish I could outright donate materials, but we aren't in any sort of position to do that! Also, I would love to entertain any general questions and help as best as I can any teams out.

Seth Cabe
cabes@alum.rpi.edu
860-808-6922
www.cabesystems.com (still very under construction ;)).

Seth Cabe (Team LoGHIQ) Composites Consultation Services Available

Seth Cabe — Thu, 26 Jul 2007 05:46:00 GMT

Posted by: Seth Cabe to Sponsors:Seth Cabe (Team LoGHIQ) Composites Consultation Services Available

Hi Guys,

First off, good luck to all the teams and all those involved in this 3rd DGC. I unfortunately am not currently associated with a DGC team, however my solar car team did just tie for first place this week in the Winston Solar Challenge ;). We have a serious titanium space frame chassis w/carbon/Kevlar/Nomex aerodynamic shell. Most certainly the most advanced high school produced solar electric vehicle out there. If any teams need composites consultation (free of course) just e-mail me, Seth Cabe, at cabes@alum.rpi.edu. Thanks, and keep pushing that envelope!

Regards,

Seth Cabe
Former Team LoGHIQ leader (1st DGC)

Ethics of this competition

Dan Frederiksen — Tue, 24 Jul 2007 02:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

implying that I'm a troll doesn't make it so.
how do you figure that calling the killing of thousands massmurder is a distortion?
and how do you figure these will save lives?
as I see it, robot warriers will just make mass murder easier to sell to the voters thus costing many more lives.
I'm sure hitler told the scientists that their patriotic efforts were saving great german lives too. but of course that's a very small truth covering a massive lie.
if you take a look at some of the photos used as illustration for this competition it shows military vehicles running in a desert urban environment. calling it urban makes it just palatable enough for the participants here to kid themselves that it has something to do with civilian car systems. so they can close their eyes to the evil they do so they can have fun playing with their toys.

this is a very deadly game, gentlemen. calling me a troll wont change the truth.

Ethics of this competition

LeenSTL — Mon, 23 Jul 2007 01:02:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

I take it that you don't mind distorting the facts a bit, ie, mass murder (other than what Saddam Hussein did in his reign), "maybe a million people", comparing this event designed to save lives to Hitler's efforts. Perhaps if it were a contest to save insurgent lives then you'd go along with it?

At any rate, conventional wisdom is that trolls should not be fed, so I won't attempt any further rational dialogue with this troll.

TrackB Video

DocPleasant — Fri, 20 Jul 2007 11:40:00 GMT

Posted by: DocPleasant to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

Good luck to all qualifying teams!

Ethics of this competition

Dan Frederiksen — Fri, 20 Jul 2007 10:38:00 GMT

Posted by: Dan Frederiksen to Miscellaneous:Ethics of this competition

in the context of the ongoing Iraq war where mass murder has been committed (maybe a million people) on less than reputable grounds, has any of the teams given thought to the fact that they are aiding this ongoing evil by participating here?

I trust you are fully aware of DARPA's interest in these cars?

Have you taken the time to compare the situation to n a z i engineering efforts? Should those scientists have reconsidered? should you?
(typed with spaces because somehow the forum filter was prepared to remove the word n a z i)

[Edited on 7/20/2007]

Syndication/RSS feed for the Urban Challenge forums

John Wiseman — Tue, 10 Jul 2007 04:12:00 GMT

Posted by: John Wiseman to Miscellaneous:Syndication/RSS feed for the Urban Challenge forums

To make it easier to find and read new posts on these forums, I've created
an RSS feed that is updated every half hour. You can find the feed here:

http://grandchallenge.heavymeta.org/

(Actually I have two feeds: one is just the 100 most recent posts, the other contains every post ever made.)

RSS is a way to make it easier to keep up with regularly updated web sites. http://blogspace.com/rss/readers has pointers to desktop apps for reading RSS. http://reader.google.com is a popular web-based reader.

If you have any questions or problem, feel free to contact me.

John Wiseman
jjwiseman@yahoo.com

CMU H1ghlander's Inspired Tony Scott for New Movie Deja Vu

John Wiseman — Wed, 27 Jun 2007 03:36:00 GMT

Posted by: John Wiseman to Miscellaneous:CMU H1ghlander's Inspired Tony Scott for New Movie Deja Vu

Even though CMU didn't win the competition, they sure won some major attention.

UGV Battle Tactic Scenario eBook

Ray — Wed, 13 Jun 2007 12:19:00 GMT

Posted by: Ray to Miscellaneous:UGV Battle Tactic Scenario eBook

I would love a copy of your ebook. Sent you a PM with my email.

Thanks,
Ray

UGV Battle Tactic Scenario eBook

Lance Winslow — Fri, 01 Jun 2007 10:04:00 GMT

Posted by: Lance Winslow to Miscellaneous:UGV Battle Tactic Scenario eBook

Greetings All,

Our Online Think Tank has created an interesting eBook on potential battle tactics for future UGVs in the Battlespace. Happy to email it in a .pdf to anyone interested. It is about 1mb and fun to read, perhaps of value as you think ahead into the reality of the unmanned net-centric warfare of the future. ( Lance AT carwashguys.com )

WAY-2C -machine vision for real-time color-based recognition and control.

Robert McConnell — Wed, 23 May 2007 08:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Robert McConnell to Vendor/Suppliers:WAY-2C -machine vision for real-time color-based recognition and control.

WAY-2C can now be controlled in real time over a network. This new feature makes it easy to instantly pass WAY-2C new training and/or classification instructions and locations in response to data from external sources and then obtain a timely response as to what the camera sees. Using commands from the network the suite of enabled reference classes can be kept updated in response to changing surroundings and conditions.

Sick LD LRS Question ...

Jason — Wed, 16 May 2007 02:56:00 GMT

Posted by: Jason to Technology:Sick LD LRS Question ...

Hi everyone,

I was hoping maybe someone out there is familiar with the Sick LD LRS
1000. I am currently working with the unit, and I am writing a driver
for it. Although I can successfully setup a TCP connection with it and
send it a command, it fails to respond. I've verified with Wireshark
that my code is behaving correctly. Messages are being properly
constructed and pushed into the network; however (despite receiving the
message), the Sick simply does not respond. The message I am sending
is shown in the telegram protocol manual for the Sick LD-OEM/LD-LRS.
Since the manual is riddled with errors (for instance, they give the
wrong port number, mislabel packets, and never specify the default IP
of the Sick LD LRS), I believe the issue lies with their protocol
specification in that document. Has anyone else had a similar issue
or experienced this?? Were you able to find an accurate specification
for the Ethernet protocol for the Sick LD LRS. Additionally, I should
note that I have had previous experience implementing drivers for Sick
lidars, and have also had issues with their telegram protocol
specification before; however, in those cases, I was able to identify
and resolve the manual's errors.

Has anyone else experienced this? Can anyone confirm the validity of the telegram
protocol in that manual?

Thanks so much,

Jason

WAY-2C -machine vision for real-time color-based recognition and control.

Robert McConnell — Tue, 15 May 2007 01:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Robert McConnell to Vendor/Suppliers:WAY-2C -machine vision for real-time color-based recognition and control.

Proven in scores of applications requiring instantaneous training and recognition of
real multicolored and/or complex shaped objects. Check us out at <http://www.way2c.com>.

Does anyone have any experience with the US customs/temporary import process for a vehicle?

SpeedRacer — Thu, 26 Apr 2007 04:48:00 GMT

Posted by: SpeedRacer to Miscellaneous:Does anyone have any experience with the US customs/temporary import process for a vehicle?

We are teaming with members abroad and are looking to temporarilly import a vehicle into the Unites States. Does anyone have any experience on how to go about the customs import process? Specifically the method/s concerning temporary import and DOT and EPA regulations and or the exemption process. Any advice and or suggestions would be most appreciated.

Thanks
Travis Pynn

Preliminary rules = CDL

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 21 Apr 2007 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

Sparky,

You are familar with the Track "A" and Track "B", but there is also another group. Since we are lettering things, I am calling it Track "C". This third group are teams that are not on the DARPA list but are still working on solving the Army's problem, which is actually the point of it all - race or not. We are continuing to use the Urban Challenge rules so that our vehicle will be ready for the next race if no one wins this one.

Over the years we have had many vehicles of many types. The vehicle we are building up now is an M-215, AGV WENDY DARLING, is Lots of work left to do on it. Check out our website and our Yahoo news group linked from our home page. I will try to get some fresh pictures up in the next couple of days.

I worked on the driverless vehicle project that was before the Grand Challenge. It was at the end of the first Gulf War 1990/1991 and the question was how to get on driver to drive a half dozen ammo trucks at one time. Later that turned into the DARPA Grand Challenge.

GO ROBOTS !
Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Preliminary rules = CDL

Sparky — Fri, 20 Apr 2007 06:48:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

Paul-

I just want to make sure we are all clear on this. There is no Track C in the Urban Challenge, so the rules don't apply to your project. You have been working on the vehicle(s) for 4 years? Do any of your vehicles have any autonomous capability?

Sparky

Active Teams?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:26:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Active Teams?

Although we are now a Track "C" team, we continue to work on our automatic guided vehicle AGV WENDY DARLING. If no one wins in 2007 we want to be ready for the next race. Check our website and our linked Yahoo news group for latest pix and info. If anyone would like to help, we can always use a hand saving soldiers lives.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:18:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

Weng,

I would like to know more about your technolgy for possible demonstration on our automatic guided vehicle AGV WENDY DARLING, what can you tell us about it?

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Preliminary rules = CDL

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 09:11:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

Hi everyone,

Lots of things have changed.

We are currently a Track "C" team - that is a team working independently on solving the driverless problem, no prize money, no grant money, just a lot of lives that can be saved and a cool engineering / educational opportunity.

Considering the rules of the race, it looks our automatic guided vehicle AGV WENDY DARLING is the best choice out of our three vehicles to focus on. It is a classic M-215 Army truck with the shorter of the two options wheel base. Light weight by today's truck standards it gets pretty good gas milage.

If you are looking for a team to join so that you can keep working on solving the problem, please consider joining my team. We are getting ready for the next race.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Attachments:

id_m215_02_700.jpg (52Kb)

Josh - STI laser - front bumper- Bay 6.jpg (1377Kb)

Full Size Vehicle available

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 08:36:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Full Size Vehicle available

Hi everyone,

AIM has a dune buggy for sale $1,000 FOB Traverse City, MI
1965 VW front end.
Tube frame
1966 VW transmission
1967 (Dual Port) air cooled engine.

Box of additional parts to go with it.

GO ROBOTS !

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 Cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

weng — Thu, 19 Apr 2007 02:45:00 GMT

Posted by: weng to Teaming:Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

Paul,

I have received your email and sent you the documentation.

-John

Open Source Urban Challenge

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Wed, 18 Apr 2007 06:21:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Teaming:Open Source Urban Challenge

Due to lack of adequate funding we (Team CyberRider) decided to withdraw our entry from this year's Challenge.
Instead we are channeling our efforts into Team Thunderbird's open source entry and would encourage any other team that dropped out to do the same. In fact we are heading up to Vancouver on May 5 to partake in one of their work sessions and get a better feel for exactly where they are at.
Ivar S. Team CyberRider

Virginia Tech tragedy

arturomdn — Mon, 16 Apr 2007 02:58:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Virginia Tech tragedy

Just saw the terrible news on CNN about the students massacred in class - no words to describe this heinous act.
My prayers and thoughts are with you, VT.

Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

weng — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 01:22:00 GMT

Posted by: weng to Technology:Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

The Embodied Intelligence Lab of Michigan State University is a member
of a team, but its totally custum built vehicle can not pass DARPA's
stock chassis or CA registration requirement in time. Thus, its
biologically inspired, attention based Multilayer In-place Learning
Network technology is available to a strong team that can put the
technology into good use. Contact: weng at cse.msu.edu.

Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

weng — Fri, 13 Apr 2007 01:17:00 GMT

Posted by: weng to Teaming:Attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology

The Embodied Intelligence Lab of Michigan State University is a member of a team, but its totally custum built vehicle can not pass DARPA's stock chassis or CA registration requirement in time. Thus, its biologically inspired, attention based Multilayer In-place Learning Network technology is available to a strong team that can put the technology into good use. Contact: weng at cse.msu.edu.

lane_width value for 4.5m?

Jeffferson Joe — Thu, 15 Mar 2007 09:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Jeffferson Joe to Miscellaneous:lane_width value for 4.5m?

The RNDF specifications say that the value for lane_width should be an integer.
The 4.5m width specification equates to about 14.76 feet.

So should we use 14, 15, or 14.76 as a value for lane_width?

ITFR00

DaveB — Wed, 14 Mar 2007 10:24:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:ITFR00

As Phil Stevenson says, at: http://gis.ou.edu/pipermail/okgis/2004-Oc tober/000266.html

"Every time I use the term WGS84 I really mean ITRF00 because there is not a way for me to determine an actual WGS84 position."

Many high-accuracy GPS systems use the OmniSTAR corrections. Their site at http://www.omnistar.com/faq.html says:

"A. OmniSTAR VBS in North America is on the NAD83 datum and ITRF00 in all other OmniSTAR world areas. OmniSTAR HP and XP are in ITRF00, worldwide."

Since VBS is their least accurate system, you can assume the position reported by your GPS is in ITRF00.

ITFR00

Tyler Folsom — Wed, 14 Mar 2007 04:25:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Rules:ITFR00

It wasn't the ITRF00 that confused me so much as DARPA's replacing "float" with the undefined "fixed". To me, fixed is an integer quantity with a virtual radix point. If you represent latitude or longitude with a six digit integer, your maximum resolution is 1.5 second. To get better than that, you can give an integer as a Northing and an Easting as is done in the UTM system. That only works if you have a grid reference, which was not specified.
What DARPA really means by "fixed" is %.6f in C. This is a double precision number, not an int.

ITFR00

Tyler Folsom — Tue, 13 Mar 2007 12:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Rules:ITFR00

Did anyone notice the change to the RNDF format that DARPA made on December 1, 2006? Latitudes and longitudes for waypoints are no longer given in degrees. They are to be six digit integers in the ITRF00 reference frame. The sample_RNDF supplied by DARPA has not been updated to this format and no example of it is provided. DARPA requires that the site visit RNDF (due March 16, 2006) use this format.
From what I have been able to find on this format (International Terrestrial Reference Frame of 2000), it appears to use UTM (Universal Transverse Mercator) coordinates. However, UTM requires a grid reference and there is none in the RNDF format. The RNDF format specifies negative numbers for longitude, but this is not done in UTM. Northing is a seven digit integer, not the six digits specified.
Does anyone understand ITRF00?

AZ Site Visit Site Info Available

SAMI — Mon, 12 Mar 2007 11:00:00 GMT

Posted by: SAMI to Qualification Process:AZ Site Visit Site Info Available

The test track for A Bunch of Dropouts is now complete.

Please visit our web site to view the site visit information. It's all at www.samitherobot.com with the information under Test Track.

We invite anybody who is interested in using our test track to contact Laura at laura@samitherobot.com or 928-380-1500.

New(er) SICK Sensors

Jdizzle — Thu, 01 Mar 2007 09:19:00 GMT

Posted by: Jdizzle to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

A cheaper alternative might be the OS3101 from Omron STI.

http://www.sti.com/products/OS3101/index. htm

New Hardened DC PC & DARPA Discount Offer

Aplus Mobile Inc. — Tue, 27 Feb 2007 02:33:00 GMT

Posted by: Aplus Mobile Inc. to Vendor/Suppliers:New Hardened DC PC & DARPA Discount Offer

Aplus Mobile, Inc. is an OEM that Designs, Develops and Manufactures 12-24 Volt DC Powered Hardened Personal Computers.

The A20-MC is:

1. Cast-aluminum and sealed so no dirt or water can seep through.
2. Includes an Aplus Mobile designed Uninterruptible Power Supply (12V-UPSTM) which automatically turns on when it detects a power glitch.
3. Draws so little power (<40W) that it can be plugged directly into a cigarette lighter socket.
4. Runs all of the same applications and operating systems (Windows, Linux and QNX) as a laptop.

Discount Offer to All DARPA Teams:
1. OEM pricing (20-piece price break) for individual unit sales on all Aplus Mobile hardware.
2. OEM priority for spare parts and replacement systems.
3. Free, limited engineering support (by phone or email) will be available during system installation. (A Service Contact is typically required.)

Please find the brochure for the A20-MC and peripheral hardware options attached & on our website at www.AplusMobile.com or email me for more information.
Best Regards,
Amy Ciesielka
AmyC@AplusMobile.com

Attachments:

A20 pricing structure_Feb23-2007.pdf (20Kb)

Std_A20-MC Datasheet_RevC_02-2007.pdf (323Kb)

Wireless Emergency Stop System

torctech — Fri, 23 Feb 2007 03:35:00 GMT

Posted by: torctech to Qualification Process:Wireless Emergency Stop System

As most of you know, DARPA will NOT be supplying an emergency stop system for testing or sites visits and is requiring each team to provide a wireless emergency stop system for site visits (see DARPA Site Visit Guidelines). TORC Technologies is offering the SafeStop™ ES-200 wireless emergency stop system at a 28% discount, to DARPA Urban Challenge teams. The SafeStop™ ES-200 is a multilevel, wireless emergency stop system for unmanned and autonomous vehicles. The handheld transmitter controls independent pause and stop relays, and provides visual and audible feedback of the state of the relays and communication link. The transmitter will operate for over 30 hours on a single charge, and can be used up to 5 miles away from the vehicle mounted receiver. The 4” x 4” x 2” receiver includes a serial data output in addition to the two 5A relays. With 32 channels to choose from, multiple SafeStop™ systems can be used simultaneously.

http://share.torctech.com/SafeStop/ES-200 _Flyer.pdf

Call us today at 540-443-9262 ext 1 to order your SafeStop™ ES-200 wireless emergency stop system. Good luck to each team in the DARPA Urban Challenge!

[Edited on 6/15/2007]

Attachments:

Wireless Emergency Stop System

torctech — Fri, 23 Feb 2007 03:33:00 GMT

Posted by: torctech to Vendor/Suppliers:Wireless Emergency Stop System

As most of you know, DARPA will NOT be supplying an emergency stop system for testing or sites visits and is requiring each team to provide a wireless emergency stop system for site visits (see DARPA Site Visit Guidelines). TORC Technologies is offering the SafeStop™ ES-200 wireless emergency stop system at a 28% discount, to DARPA Urban Challenge teams. The SafeStop™ ES-200 is a multilevel, wireless emergency stop system for unmanned and autonomous vehicles. The handheld transmitter controls independent pause and stop relays, and provides visual and audible feedback of the state of the relays and communication link. The transmitter will operate for over 30 hours on a single charge, and can be used up to 5 miles away from the vehicle mounted receiver. The 4” x 4” x 2” receiver includes a serial data output in addition to the two 5A relays. With 32 channels to choose from, multiple SafeStop™ systems can be used simultaneously.

Call us today at 540-443-9262 ext 1 to order your SafeStop™ ES-200 wireless emergency stop system. Good luck to each team in the DARPA Urban Challenge!

http://share.torctech.com/SafeStop/ES-200 _Flyer.pdf

[Edited on 6/15/2007]

HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Tommy — Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:18:00 GMT

Posted by: Tommy to Technology:HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

I'm using the HMR3000 with success. Calibrating the device only took an hour and the results have been reasonably accurate and responsive. I just use the RS232 interface. I don't use LabVIEW for anything since it is unnessary overhead on top of the very fast real-time features of XP. My software is multi-threaded Microsoft C++ and rides down on the drive shaft such that even though I do 2 dimensional laser processing 20 times a second accurate to 1 inch at 80 feet, satellite, HMR3000, actuator and stepping motor control for the brakes, gas, gear and steering, the CPU is busy only 15% of the time.

Good luck,
Tommy Spurrier

Single_yellow

dukenana — Thu, 22 Feb 2007 04:53:00 GMT

Posted by: dukenana to Rules:Single_yellow

Hi,
According to the RNDF guideline single_yellow is not on the line list.
According to the Site visit guideline schemes single_yellow is OK (for the center of the segment)
So is it OK to draw a single_yellow for the Site visit?
Regards

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

Virginia — Mon, 19 Feb 2007 12:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Virginia to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

"It would seem to me that it would be better to perform fine-tuned lane following using visual systems on the vehicle that do not depend on external signals. What do other people think of this rule?"

If I were a guerilla and I knew that an autonomous vehicle was using visual cues as its primary means for lane following, it seems like a can of paint would be all that I need in order to paint over existing lines and paint some new lines that would run a convoy off the road.

site-visit site

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Mon, 19 Feb 2007 05:44:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Qualification Process:site-visit site

I took a drive out to Johannesburg this weekend. The streets are paved and grided perfectly, but unfortunately not wide enough. If I read the sitevisit requirement correctly one needs 2 lanes each 4.5 meters wide = 9m total width.

Good luck finding 4 'real' streets anywhere that intersects to form a 250 - 500 m loop and are 9m wide.

The only thing I can think of is to reserve 100 x 120 m portion of a large (stadium) parkinglot and stripe it with lanes for the event... (and have the vision system go crazy seeing all the striped parking spots)

SwRI Site Visit Info Now Available w/ Updated RNDF

SwRI — Fri, 16 Feb 2007 12:10:00 GMT

Posted by: SwRI to Miscellaneous:SwRI Site Visit Info Now Available w/ Updated RNDF

The SwRI Site Visit Course is ready! The RNDF, aerial photos, and ground photos are now available. To view additional aerial photos, ground photos, or access the RNDF, visit http://urban.challenge07.googlepages.com/ sitevisitcourse.

The Site Visit course will be available seven days a week starting March 15th. We will also have a full practice course available on the weekends.

If you like to make arrangements for the Site Visit course and/or the full practice course, please contact Dawn Domaschk at ddomaschk@swri.org or 210-522-6782.

[Edited on 3/12/2007]

Attachments:

SwRI_Site_Visit_RNDF(v2.0).txt (2Kb)

SwRI_Site_Visit_Course_Map.jpg (948Kb)

SwRI Site Visit Info Now Available w/ Updated RNDF

SwRI — Fri, 16 Feb 2007 12:07:00 GMT

Posted by: SwRI to Qualification Process:SwRI Site Visit Info Now Available w/ Updated RNDF

Attachments:

SwRI_Site_Visit_RNDF(v2.0).txt (2Kb)

SwRI_Site_Visit_Course_Map.jpg (948Kb)

AZ Site Visit Site Available

SAMI — Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:08:00 GMT

Posted by: SAMI to Qualification Process:AZ Site Visit Site Available

A Bunch of Dropouts will be completing it's site visit course by February 23. It is an approximately 300 meter course in rural northern Arizona.

The course is all dirt and is on 75 acres of privately owned land. It is available 24/7 and we extend an open invitation to any teams who would like to use it. Contact Laura Albert at Laura@Samitherobot.com if you are interested.

Here is Open Source

Tyler Folsom — Fri, 09 Feb 2007 02:59:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Technology:Here is Open Source

UBC Thunderbird Robotics has gone open source. We are building on an open source simulator and controller developed at NIST. I have modified the simulator so that it works for Urban Challenge. Next step is the controller. Details are on www.tfolsom.com.

Open Source Urban Challenge

Tyler Folsom — Fri, 09 Feb 2007 02:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Teaming:Open Source Urban Challenge

Anyone looking to join a team is welcome at UBC Thunderbird Robotics. We have developed the vehicle hardware locally. We are going open source on the software, based on code developed by NIST. More details are on www.tfolsom.com.

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

MMNETSEA — Mon, 05 Feb 2007 04:23:00 GMT

Posted by: MMNETSEA to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Militoy, Thanks - I would like to connect 2 x 12 volt 95 amp Alternators in series on a new engine on a cruising yacht.

The existing systems are 24v and 12 v run off banks of 6 volt batteries.

The reason for wanting 2 x 12v as apposed to a single 24v is purely a question of back up ie: if one 12v goes down = still have one.

What type of other "electronics" would be required to keep everything safe and in balance .
Your help/input would be appreciated.

P.S. How much HP is consumed per AMP produced ?

RS-422 Adapters

Jason — Tue, 30 Jan 2007 12:03:00 GMT

Posted by: Jason to Technology:RS-422 Adapters

Thanks Chip. I'll have a look.

Jason

SwRI Site Visit Course

SwRI — Thu, 25 Jan 2007 02:21:00 GMT

Posted by: SwRI to Miscellaneous:SwRI Site Visit Course

Starting March 15, 2007, SwRI will be offering a site visit course open to all urban challenge teams. The course will be compliant will all DARPA site visit guidelines. You can view the attached brochure for more information or contact Dawn Domaschk at ddomaschk@swri.org.

[Edited on 1/25/2007]

Attachments:

SwRISiteVisitFlyer.pdf (119Kb)

SwRI Site Visit Course

SwRI — Thu, 25 Jan 2007 02:18:00 GMT

Posted by: SwRI to Qualification Process:SwRI Site Visit Course

Attachments:

SwRISiteVisitFlyer.pdf (119Kb)

RS-422 Adapters

Chip — Wed, 24 Jan 2007 11:34:00 GMT

Posted by: Chip to Technology:RS-422 Adapters

B&B Electronics also has some pretty good stuff.

EMC

ptrep — Wed, 24 Jan 2007 07:14:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Miscellaneous:EMC

They manufacture their own motors in house. The only interface to it is via rs-232, digital i/o, and analog i/o. In the last grand challenge, we used a simple serial relay board and a serial dac board to communicate with it.

USB 2.0 Flash Drive

Globalwarming — Tue, 23 Jan 2007 12:28:00 GMT

Posted by: Globalwarming to Miscellaneous:USB 2.0 Flash Drive

Theoretically a usb 2.0 drive max speed is 480mbit/s, depending on your harddrives rpm, internal rates of 7200rpm can be up to 561 mbit/s

globalwarming awareness2007

[Edited on 1/25/2007]

site-visit site

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Sun, 21 Jan 2007 05:35:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Militoy - Thanks for your advice. I apologize for my poorly chosen words. Actually my hat is off to those who are rugged enough to eke out a living there. What I meant to say was 'sparsely populated towns'.

IMU's

Bill — Sat, 20 Jan 2007 09:45:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Technology:IMU's

Ivar,
Take a look at these people, http://www.memsense.com/index.asp we evaluated them for our ARVs for search and rescue. We were done around $1000-2000 a system.

site-visit site

Militoy — Sat, 20 Jan 2007 01:33:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Ivar - The residents of Randsburg, Red Mountain and Johannesburg may cooperate with you in letting you set up some testing, but I don't believe they would exactly appreciate the term "semi-deserted old mining town"! When you go up there to ask around, I also advise against you using the term "ghost town" - as that's a sore subject with many of the longtime residents there.

site-visit site

Steve — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 12:59:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Well, on the one hand, I feel somewhat better that I am not the only one with the problem. On the other hand, I hope each of you solve it easily.

arturomdn -- Last time I thought you used SwRI (if I have my teams straight). While it is probably over an hour away, it seems they should be glad to help again. Any other reason you are passing that up?

Just my comment.

site-visit site

arturomdn — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 10:47:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Steve - Yes, we used SwRI in 2005 and they were fantastic hosts. We would like to host the site visit in a place where we have done lots of testing, and therefore our first choice is to look for something closer. Our first inquiry into the private parking lot that I mentioned earlier has come back negative. It is a lot easier to find someone with the authority to say "no" than to find someone with the authority (and interest) to say "yes". The search continues.

site-visit site

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 07:42:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Qualification Process:site-visit site

I remember driving on 395 north of Victorville coming across some semi-deserted old mining 'towns' Johannesburg and Randsburg. Johannesburg actually looks pretty good. http://www.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en& amp;q=Johannesburg,+CA&ie=UTF8&z= 17&ll=35.36844,-117.636634&spn=0. 003954,0.00913&t=k&om=1
It might be worth a trip to see if the 'mayor' or whoever is in charge out there would be interested in a small donation. Is there any other So Cal team that wants to collaborate on this? Ivar

RS-422 Adapters

Chip — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 04:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Chip to Technology:RS-422 Adapters

Try Sealevel or BlackBox. I've used both brands in the past with great success.

[Edited on 1/20/2007]

RS-422 Adapters

Jason — Fri, 19 Jan 2007 01:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Jason to Technology:RS-422 Adapters

Hi all,

I was wondering if anybody can recommend a good (i.e. reliable/high quality)

RS-232 to RS-422 or USB 2.0 to RS-422 adapter.

Thanks in advance,

Jason

EZ Magnetic Compass

arturomdn — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 08:59:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Technology:EZ Magnetic Compass

A digital compass uses tilt compensation to estimate heading, and tilt is affected by acceleration/deceleration of the frame of reference.
See this article about how low cost devices estimate heading. Minor errors in heading can accumulate and result in big errors if you are using it to perform dead-reckoning in GPS denied situations.

http://www.ssec.honeywell.com/magnetic/da tasheets/lowcost.pdf

"ACCELERATION EFFECTS
Any acceleration of the compass will effect the tilt or
accelerometer outputs and will result in heading errors.
An aircraft making a turn will cause the tilt sensors to
experience the centripetal force in addition to gravity and
the compass heading will be in error. However, for most
applications the acceleration is small, or is in effect for a
short duration, making a magnetic compass a useful
navigation tool. Inertial reference systems would be the
solution for applications that can not tolerate these
heading errors. These systems would weigh, cost, and
consume power at least 10 times more than those of a
strapdown magnetic compass."

site-visit site

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 07:26:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Thanks Art for your suggestions. A portion of a parking lot might be an option. Ideally I'd like to use (painted) lanemarkings instead of cones for the road definitions. I wonder if we could lobby DARPA to use a loop with two 3 way tees instead of a full 4 way cross. That is easy to find. The drive ways around most industrial buildings fullfill this requirement and all combinations of going straight, turning right and turning left can be done. Ivar

EZ Magnetic Compass

Bong — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 03:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Bong to Technology:EZ Magnetic Compass

Hi,

I am again evaluating another type of Magnetic Compass; EZ-Compass-3A. This instrument feedbacks Pitch, Roll and Azimuth value. I am just wondering if anyone in the forum have experience with this kind of sensor. Has anybody in the forum made a LabVIEW interface to this sensor?

Any help / advise I would greatly appreciate.

kind regards,

site-visit site

arturomdn — Wed, 17 Jan 2007 10:44:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Qualification Process:site-visit site

Hi Ivar,

We have been wondering the same thing. We are considering securing permission to use a parking lot in private property.
It happens to have a 4-way stop with white lines already there.

There is a large parking lot in the Orange Coast College campus, do you think they might let you use a section?
Aerial picture here. Parking lots around the Pacific Amphitheater look interesting too, they have some builtin stop lines,
picture here.

Art

[Edited on 1/18/2007]

site-visit site

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Wed, 17 Jan 2007 08:44:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Qualification Process:site-visit site

We are having problems finding a site in Southern California that meets DARPA's requirements for a site visit.
Getting a permit to shut down public streets is a little difficult when you don't know the date or time.
Any suggestions?
Ivar S team CyberRider

EMC

arturomdn — Tue, 16 Jan 2007 03:24:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:EMC

Fitting the vehicle with do-it-yourself drive-by-wire is not for the faint of heart. You might save money, but
you won't save time. Reading some of the technical papers from previous events can be helpful should you
decide to do it yourself. For a specific electric motor for steering actuator and pictures of how it was attached
to the steering shaft, see our team technical paper (click here to avoid annoying space in URL below):

http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge05/Tec hPapers/Austin_Robot_Technology.pdf

Several teams reported burnt steering motors/controllers prior to the site visits in 2005. Make sure you size
the motor properly. We decided to use a high torque (high current) motor with a 10:1 gear head, this allowed
the actuator to turn the wheels quickly even when the engine was off (no power steering). We also selected
a motor that had a built-in encoder and a controller. We were happy with our choice.

EMC

LeenSTL — Tue, 16 Jan 2007 01:59:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:EMC

EMC has servo motors for steering, plus some parts of their system is electronic for automatic transmissions etc. If you just want to see the basics of a closed loop steering system you can go to the Robotek site and see if they still have the link for building a full size R/C car. It is short on details but shows an overview.

IMU's

Militoy — Mon, 15 Jan 2007 07:22:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:IMU's

The caution I noted regarding Kalman filters related to the differences between firmware algorithms used in airborne IMUs and those designed for use in ground vehicle applications. For instance - PC Flight Systems makes a low-cost MEMS IMU called the eGYRO-XP, which is designed as a strap-on electronic gyro and EFIS module for General Aviation use. If installed onto a ground vehicle and calibrated, when the vehicle is moved into a pitched or rolled attitude and held static, the IMU’s firmware will within a few seconds “correct” the data baseline and establish a new “straight and level” baseline at the new attitude. The Kalman filter algorithm used is not designed to accurately interpret a long-term static pitch or roll condition – since those are not conditions encountered during normal flight dynamics. The data could be corrected by post-processing – but why not just select an IMU designed for ground vehicular applications?

As far as acceleration goes – a prudently-designed IMU made for vehicular applications should have a higher level of shock and vibration tolerance than one designed for flight dynamics – except perhaps a flight IMU designed for AUF or AIF environments, or similar.

EMC

jimbo — Mon, 15 Jan 2007 05:32:00 GMT

Posted by: jimbo to Miscellaneous:EMC

Can you elaborate on the steering mechanism?
-or- point me to it....

I am looking for specific part numbers. Eg was it an electric motor? [ part number ], linkage [anything you care to publish]

thanks
jim pruett
gpscruise.com

IMU's

Marcel — Mon, 15 Jan 2007 03:26:00 GMT

Posted by: Marcel to Technology:IMU's

@ Miltoy,
Most IMU's are excellent for ground vehicles, since there are less extra accelerations (other than gravity), that may make the reference for roll and pitch inaccurate. Some IMU manufacturers (such as Xsens.com) integrate IMU's with other sensors, such as vision, GPS and more. You can get specifications of these new products on request.

Kalman filtering is the most important part of an IMU, since most IMU manufacturers use the same MEMS sensors.

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

MarcIrvin — Sun, 14 Jan 2007 12:24:00 GMT

Posted by: MarcIrvin to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

All the way at the bottom of the program are the argv's which pickup the name .txt and all. I have gone through the code and can not see where the program writes any report or output data file. I am beginning to think this is prototype code and just loads up the data in the two files. It is up to the users to actually write the code that does real work.

If the program does write out a map or something how about a screen shot?

I am smiling...

tranformable robots

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:44:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Miscellaneous:tranformable robots

The first two races DARPA was looking for entries like you suggest. Things that changed shape were suggested.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 13 Jan 2007 12:26:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin,

Do you still want to be in the race?

My team is working for shares of the prize money, shares are based on how many hours you put in. My team members are scattered all over the place and are working by computer. Whatever skills you have, we can find a use for them, and those of the people you know too.

Join my team.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

tranformable robots

bigblue4101 — Sat, 13 Jan 2007 01:32:00 GMT

Posted by: bigblue4101 to Miscellaneous:tranformable robots

Thats odd, because when I looked through the info on the website, I didn't see anything pertaining to that?

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin — Fri, 12 Jan 2007 07:36:00 GMT

Posted by: Joaquin to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Hi Paul,
We have actually backed out of the competition due to lack of funding.
-Joaquin

tranformable robots

DaveB — Mon, 08 Jan 2007 08:30:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:tranformable robots

Nope

1) Rule 3.2 requires entries to be built on a full size vehicle chassis
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/rules .asp

2) The application period closed in October, 2006

[Edited on 1/13/2007]

SEO Consultant

SEO Consultant — Sun, 07 Jan 2007 10:54:00 GMT

Posted by: SEO Consultant to Vendor/Suppliers:SEO Consultant

SEO is an acronym for "Search Engine Optimization". If anyone is
interested in getting their websites ranked to higher positions in the
Search Engines, this is what an SEO Consultant
does. I'm not sure if this is a relevant fit for this forum, but
thought I'd list my SEO services in the Vendor section...just in case.

Thanks.

tranformable robots

bigblue4101 — Sun, 07 Jan 2007 06:18:00 GMT

Posted by: bigblue4101 to Miscellaneous:tranformable robots

I was wondering if you could enter in transformable robots into the darpa grand challenge?
Because if they allow that, I have the idea of building a transformable robot based on the optimus prime theme from G1 transformers.

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

DaveB — Fri, 05 Jan 2007 10:50:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

MarkIvin asks, "My input txt files still have tab characters, do I need to change them to blanks or some such thing"

Nope, the latest RNDF/MDF format definition (12/6/06) requires tab delimiters. See the Rules page.

It looks possible that your interpretation of the file name is different than the programmer's. The sample MDF lists the RNDF file name without a suffix, but the posted RNDF file name has a .txt suffix. My guess is that you left the .txt suffix on the file, but the programmer interprets the file name in the MDF literally, so it's looking for Sample_RNDF_Rev_1.2 rather than Sample_RNDF_Rev_1.2.txt

It seems like I remember DARPA addressing this naming problem, but I can't find it in the FAQ files. Personally, I think if they provide an RNDF file named Sample_RNDF_Rev_1.2.txt then that's what should be in the MDF, but maybe that's too much to ask. I suspect they only added the .txt suffix to simplify publishing it on the net, but sheesh!

Just smile

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

MarcIrvin — Thu, 04 Jan 2007 11:47:00 GMT

Posted by: MarcIrvin to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

HI,

OKAY, I was able to get the strtok() deprecate thing bypassed with some help from someone on the C++ forum who had me add a define line.
#define _CRT_SECURE_NO_DEPRECATE 1

Unfortunately, that left me with one other error LNK2019. The error said it could not find the external reference to _WinMain@16. After research I was able to figure out how to tell the LINKer to replace /SUBSYSTEM:WINDOWS with /SUBSYSTEM:CONSOLE, and I was able to build an .exe, but I don't know if its working.

I know I can not complain about freeware, but when it came time to run the code I was guessing about the input and output I should see. Here are some of my experiments, none of which met with success. My input txt files still have tab characters, do I need to change them to blanks or some such thing. I just downloaded the files straight to the work directory.

What exactly is Usage: RNDF-MDF RNDFfile MDFfile trying to say?

c:\mvi>translater
Usage: RNDF-MDF RNDFfile MDFfile
PARSE ERROR: No RNDF file name.
c:\mvi>translater RNDF-MDF c:\mvi\Sample_RNDF.txt c:\mvi\Sample_MDF.txt
PARSE ERROR: Could not open RNDF file.
c:\mvi>translater RNDF-MDF Sample_RNDF.txt Sample_MDF.txt
PARSE ERROR: Could not open RNDF file.
c:\mvi>translater Sample_RNDF.txt Sample_MDF.txt

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

MarcIrvin — Thu, 04 Jan 2007 03:49:00 GMT

Posted by: MarcIrvin to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

I can't get the parser to compile on the newest MS version on C++ because strtok() is deprecated. That is MS VS C++ Express which I was able to trial for free. Can someone give me an .exe or point me at some freeware C++ compiler that will build the parser? This is what I posted on the MSDN C++ Forum...

"I have a program reportedly compiled with VS C++ V6 that I need to compile, (no using the new VS C++ Express. The only major error message preventing the build come from deprecation of the strtok() commands in the program. I have searched all over the internet, and gotten advice to swith to strtok_s or turnoff the deprecation. I can't find a step by step detail instruction on how to turnoff deprecate in VS C++ Express, nor can I find any step by step conversion instructions for a replacement command that works. For example, if I do what the compiler says, change the strtok to strtok_s or _r even the resulting build does not even recognize the commands. I am hoping that this is a simple matter for the experts among you. I just don't understand why I can not find a cookbook solution to avoid posting a question. "

-----
Also, another angle I am working is I have installed a Fedora Core 6 Linux machine under VMware Beta . But I don't have a chops yet for doing a build compiles on it yet. Work in progress.

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 12:39:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Great stuff, send more.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

igus® Inc. donates FREE products to DARPA participants!

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 12:26:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Sponsors:igus® Inc. donates FREE products to DARPA participants!

It is great to see a manufacturer take an interest in what we are trying to do.
Thank you for your support.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 12:08:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Sponsors:Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

Seth,

If you are not on one of the 86 teams, and want to still be in the race, we could always use a hand. Contact me to work out the details.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Need Support

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 12:01:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Sponsors:Need Support

If you didn't make it to the DARPA list of 86 teams but still want to be in the race, my team can always use more hands. Contact me and we will see if we can work together.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Team ATR Is On Thin Ice

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 11:58:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Sponsors:Team ATR Is On Thin Ice

If your team didn't make it to the DARPA list of 86 teams but you still want to be in the race, my team can always use a hand. Contact me and we can work out the details of how to make this work.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Technical Writer writing about your team.

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 11:50:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

Teams are invited to join the newsgroup http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/autono mousvehiclemfg/ to carry on DUC duscussions in the newgroup format rather than the forum format here. There is an archive of messages there that might be interesting to review.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 11:31:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Jauquin,

I don't see your team name on the DARPA list.
Are you under a different name now?

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 11:00:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Bob H.

I don't see a Chicago dot on the DARPA map, do you still want to be on a team?
I could use a hand, we have other team members in Chicago.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Looking for a team - Tampa FL

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:57:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team - Tampa FL

Paul Ramos,
Have you joined a team yet? We could use always use another hand if you are available.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Full Size Vehicle available

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:54:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Full Size Vehicle available

I don't see an attached file but would like to know more about your vehicle. Is it still available?

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Looking for a team - Image Processing

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:47:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Bren,

Last year we had not raised enough money to buy the things we needed so we provided critical technical support to the teams that were on the starting line. We are making good progress getting our US Army truck ready for the 2007 race.

Are you still available?

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:27:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Grasshopper,
My team could always use another hand if you are still available.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Building S. California Team

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:16:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Building S. California Team

Follow up: Thomas, were you successful at forming a team? What is the team name?
If you are still looking to be on a team, we could always use a hand.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Looking to join a team in the Connecticut area.

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:13:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking to join a team in the Connecticut area.

Hey Tom, found a team yet? We could always use a hand.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Indiana (hopefully, central)

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:07:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Indiana (hopefully, central)

Are you looking for a team to be on for the 2007 race? We could always use one more.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Serious Competition?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 10:03:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Serious Competition?

Obviously the comotion we caused has awakened the industrial giants. Will they be able to get their ponderous bulk working on the Urban Challenge problem and arrive at a workable answer fast enough to be in the race? As mentioned above, will these big organizations allow their DUC team the freedom they need? In some cases yes, in others no. It should be a good race.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Any vehicles from last year for sale?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 09:55:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Any vehicles from last year for sale?

Mark,
If you have not found a vehicle yet, some of the newest cars, especially the European version of then are drive by wire. The EC has mandated that traffic fatalities be cut in half by 2010 and to meet these new safety standards car companies are having to go to active safety systems which amount to computer control of the entire car. They have exhausted the life-savings that can be done with passive safety systems.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Greater Autonomy

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 09:46:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Greater Autonomy

In this race DARPA does not plan to use the e-stop to prevent collisions, only to prevent the vehicles from leaving the race area. They are going to let the vehicles do what they do to see what that is. Considering the NY TAXI driver behavior required and illustrated at the Participants Conference, that any vehicle that is not prepared for contact is not prepared for the race. One of the rules is "no external fuel tanks" in this race, which should be taken as a hint from the race officials. TerraMax is is this race. Expect to meet it at the interesections and be prepared to avoid it. The new version is one axel shorter. Be concerned about the smallest vehicle too. You don't want to get the little one caught in your vehicles teeth and have it stop the two of you. Shock to the electronics may be from the side this race. Last race it was from below.

TrackB Video

Militoy — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 02:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

Out of curiosity - what kind of roads/terrain/traffic control would be available for any testing? Do you have private road access, or authority over public road control, or (?) What dates would be available for testing?

Greater Autonomy

Militoy — Sun, 31 Dec 2006 01:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Rules:Greater Autonomy

I got the impression from the first site visit that if your own vehicle were to contact another, that would be the end of the race for your team. If another team's vehicle were to strike yours, a 5 MPH bumper (standard on all US-sold vehicles) would help prevent some of the damage - but only if the other vehicle were to contact at under 5 MPH - and only if the contact was directly on the bumper. If you're going to rely on protection from "springy bumpers", better put them 360 degrees around the vehicle! And - better hope that "Terramax" isn't involved in the accident!

Greater Autonomy

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 30 Dec 2006 02:09:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Greater Autonomy

From the acceleration spike readings I have seen for solid contact with anything, springy bumpers, shock absorbing bumpers look like a very good idea for protecting your vehicle and its contents. Model T bumpers were spring bumpers good for 5 mph crashes.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

U turn when stopsign on intersecting ???

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 30 Dec 2006 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:U turn when stopsign on intersecting ???

magnolia,

You have to submit it to grandchallenge@darpa.mil and wait for them to publish it in the FAQ for the answer to be official.
- or -
Ask yourself if the California State Police would allow you to do whatever it is you are wondering about. If you would get a ticket for it, you might want to avoid it in the race. After several phone calls about the race the California State Police have said to use common sense in keeping traffic moving.

I hope this helps you. Which team are you with?

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

TrackB Video

DocPleasant — Thu, 28 Dec 2006 09:05:00 GMT

Posted by: DocPleasant to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

Looking for interested teams to test vehicles on Lake Pleasant Pkwy gateway parkway to Lake Pleasant, AZ. Would anyone be interested?

Meet the Players

NaviGATOR — Sun, 24 Dec 2006 11:03:00 GMT

Posted by: NaviGATOR to Miscellaneous:Meet the Players

Robot Race Fans,

Follow your favorite teams progress here:
http://cimar.mae.ufl.edu/gatornation/Play ers.htm

Teams,

If you would like to share your videos or other news, please send me the links and I will add them as I can get to it.

Thanks
David Armstrong
Team Gator Nation

Media Opportunity

cvanson — Wed, 13 Dec 2006 02:46:00 GMT

Posted by: cvanson to Media:Media Opportunity

Dear DARPA Challengers,

After writing to the DARPA Challenge staff and they suggested I bring my opportunity to the forum. Please read the attached for additional details as it is too long for this message window.

Warmest regards,
Catherine Van Son
Conference Director
www.fose.com
202-772-5755
cvanson@postnewsweektech.com

Attachments:

DARPA Invitation Advanced Tech Showcase.doc (119Kb)

Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

Dagan — Tue, 12 Dec 2006 03:29:00 GMT

Posted by: Dagan to Miscellaneous:Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

Are there any available pictures ot video sequences of ths site, preferably from the vehicle's point of view?

Dagan

Prizes?

Mexico — Fri, 08 Dec 2006 11:48:00 GMT

Posted by: Mexico to Miscellaneous:Prizes?

Fortunately prizes are back (is good for sponsors).

Prizes?

DaveB — Fri, 08 Dec 2006 07:37:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Prizes?

Prizes are back. See GC Home Page

Unfortunately, still no payments for intermediate success. See new FAQ 32 of
Program Announcement & Application Process FAQ (December 8, 2006)

[Edited on 12/8/2006]

U turn when stopsign on intersecting ???

Magnolia — Wed, 06 Dec 2006 11:01:00 GMT

Posted by: Magnolia to Rules:U turn when stopsign on intersecting ???

Hi I was wondering if U turn is allowed under the following conditions:
1. when stop sign is present on the intersecting traffic but not on the main traffice. Left boundary is double yellow.
E.g. In sample map Waypoint 3.1.7

2. When the segment ends with a stop sign and exits to next segment. Left boundary is double yellow.
E.g. In sample map waypoint 3.1.14, 9.1.2

3. When the segment ends with NO stop sign and exits to next segment. Left boundary is double yellow.
E.g. In sample map waypoint 10.2.8

Any one at Darpa?????

Sincerely,
Venkata.

Be Optimistic,
Be Confident and
Be Cheerful.

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Tyler Folsom — Wed, 29 Nov 2006 05:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Here is a version that makes more of the optional stuff really optional.

[Edited on 11/29/2006]

Attachments:

RNDF-MDF-1.0.2.cpp (20Kb)

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Bill — Wed, 22 Nov 2006 10:39:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Ah me, not at this time. It is in the works for the next generation release but that would be tight for the contest. Some of us tried to build it in a user module but there is also issues with the license.

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Militoy — Wed, 22 Nov 2006 10:15:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Bill - Do you know if Cyprus equips any of their higher-end PSoC controllers with an on-board CANbus controller?

Greater Autonomy

Salty — Tue, 21 Nov 2006 12:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Salty to Rules:Greater Autonomy

The challange is giving the vehicles judgement. Avoiding accidents better be focused on. Better be able to recognize stopped vehicles that could start moving after the 5 sec delay. Just getting close to another vehicle could be dangerous since you cannot rely on others maintaining course and speed because there is anthore vehicle near.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

Salty — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 11:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Salty to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

Since DARPA seems to want safe operation within California law, it seems these should take precedance. Humans make judgements. In an urban environemnt simple rule following will probably get a vehicle in trouble.

Orphans

Salty — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 11:30:00 GMT

Posted by: Salty to Rules:Orphans

Large vehicles like semi-tractor trailers are allowed to "violate" lane restrictions and markings in order to make turns that could not be done otherwise. There is a practicle interpration element to enforcement. The standard used is to do so safely. In order to make right turns, the vehicle may start in the right lane, swing into the left lane and then start turning right coming into the oposing traffic lane before ending up in the right lane. An interesting judgenet situation occurs when another vehicle obstructs the turning vehicle. Since these vehicles do not have the abilityu to see well to the rear, it is unsafe to back up without calling the police:-( A judgement has to be made about waiting or trying to manuver.

New FAQ Responses

Salty — Mon, 20 Nov 2006 07:58:00 GMT

Posted by: Salty to Rules:New FAQ Responses

Getting a title does not indicate the vehicle is safe. The State is probably not qualified to evaluate exotic designs. The Challange is the the control of the vehicle, not to come up with a novel base vehicle.

HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Bong — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 09:30:00 GMT

Posted by: Bong to Technology:HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Thank you very much for the reply.
I did made a LabVIEW code in reference to the serial communication protocol required and I got to the point of getting the HEXA data from the sensor. While the sensor is turned ON, i can see the HEXA data are updating too. But I want to know the meaning of the HEXA data so that I can pick up the specific data I need from the sensor which is the Azimuth.
I received an example 12 page C code Message Packet code, but i am not familiar with C. Does anyone in your Group who had similar experience ? or anyone can give me a hint to decode the HEXA?

HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Militoy — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 08:40:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

I believe our sensor team has selected the Honeywell TruePoint as a backup to our fluxgate/FOA based-IMU. We were using a KVH C100 previously, and I haven’t worked with the Honeywell unit myself, but according to the manual, you need to use NI-VISA for serial communications. If you’re using LabVIEW, the Example Programs under the Help section describes a Basic Serial Write and Read routine, which should help you. The specific serial communication protocol should be outlined in the Honeywell manual and programming guide.

HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Bong — Sun, 19 Nov 2006 07:21:00 GMT

Posted by: Bong to Technology:HMR3500 True Point Magnetic Compass from Point Research Corporation

Hi,
I am sorry that this is not a Grand Challenge Issue.

We are planning to use an instrument/sensor that will give us an Azimuth value (0-360deg). The sensor is called TruePoint Digital Magnetic Compass. The maker is Honeywell which they told me they dont have LabVIEW code interface yet. I am just wondering if anyone in the forum have experience with TruePoint Magnetic Compass. I just want to know the kind of data being transmitted from the sensor to the port so that I can start decoding it.

Any help / advise I would greatly appreciate.

kind regards,

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Tyler Folsom — Mon, 13 Nov 2006 06:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Thanks! It works fine under Windows. Here is a version that works for both Windows and Linux.

[Edited on 11/13/2006]

Attachments:

RNDF-MDF-1.0.1.cpp (19Kb)

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Militoy — Wed, 08 Nov 2006 10:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Your selection of a specific embedded controller should take into consideration the experience and background of the students, as well as the user-friendliness of available support materials. Better to start them out with a simple stamp controller, or a lower-end micro like a Rabbit 3000, and then build in functions until they outgrow its capabilities - than to frustrate them with too much complexity at first. The PIC line of controllers from Microchip would be on the next level up from the Z80-evolved Rabbits, and are extremely well supported.

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Bill — Wed, 08 Nov 2006 06:50:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

The nice thing about PSoC is the new software for the new person or the engineer that just wants to try something simple as a test. Drag and drop blocks and the program writes your code.
We are currently working with that team in writing blocks that will fit our robot development kit.

PSoC Express(TM) enables the engineer to go from concept to embedded ASIC in one hour or less." PSoC Express is a free, code-free, visual design tool. Designers have access to libraries of temp. sensors, switches, potentiometers, FETs, fans, and more. This tool also auto-generates a data sheet, schematic, and bill of materials. Plus, you can easily port designs to full-featured PSoC Designer. PSoC Express is free and can be downloaded at www.cypress.com/psocexpress.

New(er) SICK Sensors

LeenSTL — Wed, 08 Nov 2006 02:26:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

The 360 degree FOV version sounds pretty interesting ... let us know how well it works out ....

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Militoy — Wed, 08 Nov 2006 01:52:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Further to above – My comment isn’t intended to impugn Bill’s suggestion in any way. The Cypress PSoC flash micros are robust products, and the one he suggests has lots of I/O, which is helpful for robotic applications. Only “BSM ACS” knows what level his students are starting from, and it’s been my experience that optimum success will result through starting with the basics, and then building upon that base. Whichever processor you choose, the evaluation/development kit available for it will be a good investment. If size isn’t too much of an issue, the evaluation board may even wind up as part of your final robot.

Prizes?

Igor — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 10:39:00 GMT

Posted by: Igor to Miscellaneous:Prizes?

Good catch. Looks like there is something going on : http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/index .asp
"...

Latest Info...

Updates to the
Prize Format
will be posted
when they become
official. ..."
Even though he is not the John Young who had a wild ride on Descartes, I like him already for considering that this is important.
Igor.

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

Bill — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 05:44:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

We build autonomous robots for S&R. The micro we use on our smaller robots is made by Cypress Semiconductor. I would use the CY8C29866. The software is a free download, and they have education programs. The controller has both analog and digital capability. There is also a wireless interface for data transfer. Contact me if you have other questions.

Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

BSM ACS — Tue, 07 Nov 2006 01:59:00 GMT

Posted by: BSM ACS to Technology:Selecting a Microcontroller/Embedded Computer for Mobile Robotics

(This is not directly related to the Grand Challenge, but I'm not sure who else to ask.)

My question, in short: is there an embedded computer that would be accessible enough for high school students?

Here's the background information:
For the third year, our high school class is designing a robot for the RoboCup Search & Rescue competition. The primary software tasks on the robot involve creating maps of the disaester area and executing low-level autonomy. Our software expectations are significantly lower than the universities participating: we are not trying to implement SLAM, machine vision, or autonomous victim identification.

We would like to integrate readings from encoders, IMUs, proximity sensors, a digital compass, and data from our laser scanner (the Hokuyo URG-04LX.) Our robot also has a thermal imager and several video cameras, however we are not attempting to integrate this data into the software (we may end up simply broadcasting it directly back to the control station.)

Ideally, we would implement a GUI on the control station computer that displays sensor data and video feeds. We would like to use joysticks and a keyboard to control the robot.

I hit the 1500 character limit, but I have more to say. Sorry for the diversion, thanks for your help, and good luck in the Urban Challenge.

Prizes?

arturomdn — Mon, 06 Nov 2006 12:22:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Prizes?

Steve - Here's another story that matches the eweek report:

"The Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency will award millions of
dollars in prize money to teams who win the Urban Challenge competition
in 2007, John J. Young, the director of defense research and
engineering, said today."

"The top three teams that complete the 60-mile course in less than six
hours will receive trophies and cash prizes. First place will receive a
$2 million prize; second is $500,000; and third, $250,000. Eighty-nine
teams are involved in the competition."

Prizes?

Steve — Sun, 05 Nov 2006 12:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:Prizes?

I saw this article. I do not know if it means anything. We will have to see.

http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,2051 441,00.asp?kc=EWRSS03119TX1K0000594

Steve

RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Magnolia — Fri, 03 Nov 2006 11:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Magnolia to Technology:RNDF MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Hi All,
Find attached the C/C++ parser for RNDF and MDF files version 1.2. Feel free to improve and/or share the code.
Tested with Visual C++ 6.0.

The same was posted in forum "Miscellaneous" earlier.

Sincerely,
Venkata.
-----------------------
Don't worry. Be Happy.
-----------------------

Attachments:

RNDF-MDF Parser.cpp (18Kb)

AutonoSys Announces World's First Lidar Video Cameras

Autonosys1 — Tue, 31 Oct 2006 02:59:00 GMT

Posted by: Autonosys1 to Vendor/Suppliers:AutonoSys Announces World's First Lidar Video Cameras

Ottawa, Canada October 23 2006 – Unique New Cameras Capture Full 3D Images At High Speed.
LIDAR systems measuring approximately 10,000 ranges/second in a line-scan are commonly available. The AutonoSys lidar video cameras measure ranges 50 times faster, at 500,000 ranges/second. With this amount of data per second, it becomes possible to produce a full 3D image of a scene at video rates of 5-10 frames a second. AutonoSys' camera has a 30° x 90° field of view, with 144 x 480 pixel resolution, updated at 5 frames/second. Range to every pixel in the frame is measured to an accuracy of a few mm. Field of view, resolution and frame rate can all be customized to meet demands of the application. Applications for the new cameras include obstacle and terrain sensing for autonomous ground vehicles, improved recognition of threats in security monitoring systems, and any other application where fast capture of 3D data is required.The lidar video camera uses a rangefinder developed by Z+F Gmbh, a manufacturer with over 20 years experience in the lidar field. The optical scanning mechanism and custom electronics in the camera was developed by AutonoSys Inc., an Ottawa based high tech company specializing in systems and sub-systems for Autonomous Vehicles. For more information contact Rob Bruce, AutonoSys, phone (613) 277 0980. Visit www.autonosys.com for videos, images and product information.

[Edited on 10/31/2006]

Simulator

Tyler Folsom — Tue, 31 Oct 2006 02:56:00 GMT

Posted by: Tyler Folsom to Technology:Simulator

The thread on Open Source is quite active. This is in some ways a reply to it, but I started a new thread for increased visibility.

The Urban Challenge is primarily a software challenge. This differs from the 2005 challenge. Since software is the prime component, a driving simulator becomes crucial and is a prime candidate for open source. There is a robot simulator for Urban Search and Rescue (USAR) on Source Forge. This is a mod to Unreal Tournament (UT) and runs on Windows or Linux. I have done a first cut of a driving simulator by modding the USAR simulator. Future plans will incorporate Unwheel, a mod to Unreal Tournament that makes it a driving game. This is not free software since it requires buying one or more copies of the UT game. Other than that, it is potentially open source.

I am team leader for Thunderbird Robotics at University of British Columbia. Making the simulator publicly available will require consensus of the team.

Check out:
http://sourceforge.net/projects/usarsim
MOAST on sourceforge
www.ubcthunderbird.com
www.tfolsom.com

Any vehicles from last year for sale?

LeenSTL — Mon, 30 Oct 2006 10:45:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Teaming:Any vehicles from last year for sale?

Did your team make it to Track B status?

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

LeenSTL — Fri, 27 Oct 2006 04:10:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Here is the pseudo-pseudocode for St Louis driving, where only rain snow or ice slows (some of ) the traffic down. They don't let anyone into their lane, yield at yield signs, stop at stop signs, or ever slow down to get behind another vehicle when changing lanes:

If another vehicle detected pulling into my lane: speed up, honk horn, flip off
If stop sign present: ignore
If vehicle ahead stopped at stop sign: honk horn, flip off
If yield sign detected: full speed ahead
If I need to change lanes: no turn signal, speed up to beat any vehicle next to me, change lane
If precipitation
case rain: slow to crawl
case ice:
If (4wd)
drive too fast, spin
Else
slow to crawl

Yah, I've had all kinds of drivers (soccer moms seem to be especially bad here) speed up to cut me off, and even honk when they had to stop behind me at a stop sign. The driving theme seems to be "You had the nerve to use turn signals? !#@$% It's MY road, stay out of my lane! Wait, I want to be in your lane, I'll speed up and just drift over."

RNDF-MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Magnolia — Thu, 26 Oct 2006 03:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Magnolia to Miscellaneous:RNDF-MDF Parser C/C++ Code

Hi All,
Find attached the C/C++ parser for RNDF and MDF files version 1.2. Feel free to improve and/or share the code.
Tested with Visual C++ 6.0.

Sincerely,
Venkata.
-----------------------
Don't worry. Be Happy.
-----------------------

Attachments:

RNDF-MDF Parser.cpp (18Kb)

Serious Competition?

ptrep — Sat, 21 Oct 2006 11:12:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Teaming:Serious Competition?

Team Gray also proves that. There was only one Ph.D. on the team, and he served in an advisory capacity. My guess is that this is one of the reasons why the team did not get Track A funding, even though they were one of the finishers.

[Edited on 10/21/2006]

AP story

Steve — Fri, 20 Oct 2006 09:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Media:AP story

Well, I am glad to see someone has reported the prize money situation correctly. It may not bring it back, but I am glad to see it corrected.

Ivar, your link got altered in the paste, I think. This is a different link that I believe gets the same story.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20061020/ap_on _hi_te/robot_challenge

Thanks
Steve

PS: I think I found your original link:

http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2006/10/20 /ap3107864.html

[Edited on 10/20/2006]

AP story

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Fri, 20 Oct 2006 08:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Media:AP story

http://www.forbes.com/business/feeds/ap/2 006/10/20/ap3107844.html

Most interesting part:

"DARPA said the change essentially strips its power to dole out prize money. But congressional aides countered that the change actually expands the authority to other defense agencies. Jenness Simler, a committee aide on the House Armed Services Committee, said DARPA can still give out cash prizes as long as it works with its boss.

Pentagon spokesman, Lt. Col. Brian Maka, said the agencies are still working out the details.

"We are not aware of a decision to not award cash prizes," Maka said in a statement""

Frankly, I think the 50k and 100k progress incentives are equally if not more important to the smaller teams. And that would make the contest a little bit more fair.

Serious Competition?

Sean — Fri, 20 Oct 2006 05:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Sean to Teaming:Serious Competition?

Stanford team proves that!

GO CAL!

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Militoy — Fri, 20 Oct 2006 05:11:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I've seen a few 24V systems on off-road vehicles that were kluged together successfully using a pair of ex-automotive alternators. Just make sure you isolate the housing of the topside alternator above system ground, as most alternators have the negative of their hexbridge tied right to ground at the housing. No reason to make more sparks and smoke than neccessary!

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

AIman — Fri, 20 Oct 2006 03:53:00 GMT

Posted by: AIman to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Yep, the challenge is offical and my understaing is that the location probably won't be revealed for some time. Besides, if I can get my car to drive in winter rush hour with snow on the road, I am not worried about a dry road.

Oh ya, I think the proper code for NY is something like this:

If light is yellow speed up.
If light turns read with 3 seconds of intersection then floor it.
If stop sign present slow down but do not stop.
If pedestrian in street drive on sidewalk.
If traffic stopped honk horn.

SICK Sensors

Moxley — Thu, 19 Oct 2006 01:53:00 GMT

Posted by: Moxley to Vendor/Suppliers:SICK Sensors

Moxley Electronics
Exton, PA
www.moxleyelectronics.com

Moxley Electronics is a Distributor/ Engineering company that specializes in providing and supporting industrial automation and safety equipment as well as providing engineered solutions with an unparalleled level of integrity. Our product lines include SICK (industrial sensors, machine safeguarding & barcoding) and Mitsubishi (VFD's, servos, PLC's, HMI's). We at Moxley Electronics would welcome the opportunity to assist with any sensing or automation needs that you may have.

SICK is offering the following 2D TOF products for the 2007 DARPA Urban Challenge:

LMS291-S05 (1018028) - 180 degree FOV, 30m @ 10% reflectivity, 75 Hz scan frequency, 0.25-0.5-1.0 adjustable angular resolution (53.3-26.6,13.3 ms time base) 38.4 and 500kB serial

LMS291-S14 (1025329) - same as above except 90 degree FOV, 0.5 fixed angular resolution, 13.3 ms fixed time base

LD-LRS1000 (1028941) - 360 FOV, 80m @ 10%, 5-10Hz scan, 0.125-1.5 angular resolution, Ethernet, CAN, RS-232

If you have any questions or if we can assist with your application, please e-mail engineering@moxleyelectronics.com with Attn: Chris Jones.

[Edited on 1/23/2007]

Attachments:

LD-LRS Product Info.pdf (499Kb)

LMS Technical Description.pdf (2209Kb)

LMS 200_291.pdf (71Kb)

LMS Fast.pdf (643Kb)

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

sapper023 — Thu, 19 Oct 2006 01:20:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

This IS odd but for your humor and my self i could
rewind the alternator 2 of the alternator windings for 12 volt charging ( 15 to 18 volts ) put a big post rectifier capacitor on the remaining only 24 coil left ( diode or ) the rotor winding controll signals from separate regulators inderectly fed through relays controlled by the regulators and use a relay to disable output of the system on what ever branch that did not need charge .
really quick note !
just from parts I have on hand yes I have the 4 additional diodes and relays that can handel 100 amps each
a 12 volt relay and 24 volt relay ( if noise was a problem I could use a chopper type of regulator made from an old wheel chair speed controller )
this would be a verry electricly noisy solution
only small capactor needed on the 12 volt side as it dumps into refrigeration system batteries which can usualy handel noise
the really inportant thing is to manage the batteries properly
kids do not try this stunt at home
of corse now that I have a metal lathe I could just make a custom alternator with 2 alternators on the same shaft and this would be 2 separate charging systems and would be about 20 to 30 percent bigger
you need to sum the electrical watts for proper signal to engine throttle controll which is powerplant system related in difficulty
for engine spin up put a delay on the regulator rotor current and use the regulator signal to engine summed without delay

[Edited on 10/19/2006]

Serious Competition?

AIman — Thu, 19 Oct 2006 01:04:00 GMT

Posted by: AIman to Teaming:Serious Competition?

Educated doesn't mean better.

Track B Funding?

AutoCommute — Wed, 18 Oct 2006 06:08:00 GMT

Posted by: AutoCommute to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

If you recall at this time in last year's Grand Challenge, there were 195 teams entered at this same stage in the application process. Ultimately, DARPA conducted site visits at 118 team sites, which is more than the total number of teams this year.

[Edited on 10/18/2006]

Track B Funding?

mjg — Wed, 18 Oct 2006 05:31:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

78 Track B Teams!!! 89 Teams Total (if i counted correctly?). The whole trophies thing is a bit of a wet blanket --but-- for any and all those who ultimately participatte what an amazing opportunity -- what a time to be alive!!

Track B Funding?

AIman — Wed, 18 Oct 2006 02:55:00 GMT

Posted by: AIman to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

Congress did vote - the prize money has been cut and trophies will be awarded instead. The updated rules cover this change.

Besides it was Congress not DARPA that made the change and some things are beyond DARPA's control.

I agree it is not as motivating to work for a trophy... on the other hand what a tropy!!!

[Edited on 10/18/2006]

UK Ministry of Defence (MoD) is launching a "grand challenge"

arturomdn — Tue, 17 Oct 2006 08:43:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Media:UK Ministry of Defence (MoD) is launching a "grand challenge"

According to this news story the UK is launching their own Grand Challenge.

It says the UK will offer trophies because "(Darpa) Grand Challenge offers a $2m (£1.14m) prize....
[but the]
UK could not match this US agency's spending
on R&D"

New(er) SICK Sensors

Jon — Sat, 14 Oct 2006 04:58:00 GMT

Posted by: Jon to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

Thanks for the update Jeff...that helps a lot. Some of the material I found on the SICK website mentioned Galileo (I believe it was the LD product line brochure), yet nothing exists in the documentation finder, so I was a little confused as to what it was.

[Edited on 10/14/2006]

New(er) SICK Sensors

Jon — Sat, 14 Oct 2006 04:56:00 GMT

Posted by: Jon to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

I was quoted a price of $7621 for the LD-LRS system by the SICK sales rep, Jeff Wuendry.

-Jon

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

TravisT — Thu, 12 Oct 2006 06:02:00 GMT

Posted by: TravisT to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

This is the perfect thread to announce “R” Junk Works “Smart
Wheelchair” project.

People like you are
the right people to work with this type of technology.

The project has been
created to improve the quality of life for the handicapped.

The types of projects your working on, like interfacing
to servos, terrain following and autonomous controls are directly
applicable.

You are encouraged to
download our freely available open source software to get a greater
understanding of how we have applied autonomous robot technology for the
handicapped.

I will have to say that it
has personally been one of my most satisfying things I have ever done in my
life and the most fun with applying robotic concepts I have ever worked
with.

Maybe it will be for you as well.

It’s all open source and may be a start on your Urban
Challenge entry.

http://www.rjunkworks.com/swc/swc.html

PS-Trevor, KNetX is my wife and my own
contracting company that has a business license here is Palmdale California and does Contract Engineering Work.
“R” Junk Works is a non-business geeky robot
club we formed here in Lancaster/Palmdale to have fun and compete in various
robot style events.

AgentWare Software and Systems Development in A.I. and Vision

Hal Popplewell — Tue, 10 Oct 2006 11:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Hal Popplewell to Vendor/Suppliers:AgentWare Software and Systems Development in A.I. and Vision

AgentWare provides advanced software development services in the following areas:

- Automous Agent - based architectures

- Vision systems (both our own software and Cognex sensors)

- Mission critical, 100% uptime software

- Computer controlled vehicles and machines

Our people developed the computer controls and recognition systems for one of the "Big Three" automakers' proving grounds, as one example.

AgentWare's RT/AI tool is the fastest multi-reasoning knowledge based system development tool (based on university benchmarks) in the world by orders of magnitude.

I am writing this because I am about to idle a development team over the next few months so if anyone needs help in any of these areas please contact me at: hal@agentwaresystems.com.

Thanks!

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

DaveB — Tue, 10 Oct 2006 10:51:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I think that would work fine, even if the regulators for the two alternators aren't exactly matched, so that one bank stays at say 13.5 volts while the other stays at 14. But I'm no expert on battery systems.

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

windpower — Mon, 09 Oct 2006 01:36:00 GMT

Posted by: windpower to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I was wondering if you could use two 12 volt alternators to charge a 24 volt battery bank via connecting one alternator to the first half of the bank and the second alternator to the second half.

I currently have one 100 amp 12 volt alternator that I got pretty cheap several years ago ($79.00) from J.C. Whiteney and would like to build a wind generator, but would like it to be in the 2500 watt range. So I figured I would need at least a 12 foot diameter blade (I will probably use 15' to offsett resistance due to having to gear it up to 6000 rpm in a 30mph wind) and might be able to use another alternator identical to the first to charge a bank of batteries.

Any suggestions on this plan are welcome......Thanks

Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

Igor — Fri, 06 Oct 2006 04:27:00 GMT

Posted by: Igor to Miscellaneous:Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

I concur with Art on this. The hosting at SwRI was VERY nice.

Igor
Pegasus Team

Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

SwRI — Thu, 05 Oct 2006 12:42:00 GMT

Posted by: SwRI to Miscellaneous:Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

Southwest Research Institute (SwRI) in San Antonio, Texas, is exploring the possibility of offering a realistic practice site for use by teams preparing for the Urban Challenge. The site would be available to all Urban Challenge teams on a pre-scheduled basis. The site would support all of the basic and advanced events outlined in the “Rules” and other pertinent documents.

This would be a private undertaking, with no official relationship to DARPA or the Urban Challenge Program. Further, SwRI is not affiliated with any team.

Our intent is to offer use of the practice site at “no-cost” to the UC teams, and to offset our costs by obtaining outside sponsors.

If your team would like more information on this potential Urban Challenge practice site, please send an email to dawn.domaschk@swri.org.

[Edited on 10/5/2006]

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

arturomdn — Thu, 05 Oct 2006 12:40:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Austin Robot Technology has an existing vehicle that competed at the 2005 NQE and is rule compliant for the Urban Challenge. We are considering offering our vehicle and existing code base to the open source community. To be competitive we will need funding. We welcome ideas on how to join forces to raise the necessary funds to make this happen.

Art

Attachments:

ART_Velodyne_1.jpg (64Kb)

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Igor — Thu, 05 Oct 2006 04:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Igor to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Ivar,

You have a very good point. I, for one, do not care about how much I invested in this so far because I know that my goals are outside of this realm of robotics. This is one of the reason we were pretty open about some of our data and code (http://pegasusbridge.blogspot.com/2005/0 5/how-do-you-drive-by-wire-car-using.html , http://www.pegasus-bridge.com).

Additional to this, there is now an expectation that the track A folks have already laid out their plans in their proposal. Hence any late add-ons of a specific way to interpret data for navigation (new algorithms) is pretty much unavailable to them.

Igor.

Equipment for sale

msv — Thu, 05 Oct 2006 02:50:00 GMT

Posted by: msv to Miscellaneous:Equipment for sale

We have quite a bit of equipment for developing your DARPA Urban Challenge entry. We aren’t entering this year so we are making the equipment available to other teams.

Any questions or to make an offer on any of these items, send e-mail to: msv (at) san.rr.com

Dual Processor Rack Mount Computer System

1x Intel Dual Xeon Motherboard, Onboard Ultra320 SCSI and Video, RAID 0,1
2x Intel Xeon 3.4GHz Nocona 1MB L2 Processors - 2 processors
2x Kingston 1GB (512MBx2) DDR333 ECC Memory - 2 GB total
1x Antec Rackmount Chassis with 550W PS, Xeon Cooling
1x CD drive

Honeywell/Point Research Vehicle Navigation Unit

GPS and Dead Reckoning Module

NovAtel Differential GPS system

Receiver, antenna, and cables

SICK LADAR Sensors

LMS291-S05
LMS291-S14 FAST

Steering Motor Assembly

Applied Motion Products BLu100S Servo Motor Controller
A0100-103-3-000 Servo Motor
Bayside 40:1 Gearbox

Warner Linear Actuators

30 lb., 50 lb., 112 lb.
All with potentiometer feedback

WiFi Equipment

2x Linksys WRT54G WiFi Routers with Sveasoft firmware
2x Telephonics 1W WiFi Amplifiers
2x MobileMark 5dB Gain Antennas

Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

arturomdn — Thu, 05 Oct 2006 02:09:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Potential Urban Challenge Practice Site

Austin Robot Technology held their site visit at SwRI last year, I can say they exceeded our expectations in preparation, professionalism, and execution... they even sent us a DVD with movies of the visit. I hope you get the sponsors, it would be great to visit again.

SICK Sensors

Travis — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 11:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Travis to Technology:SICK Sensors

I am having trouble communicating with my LMS200. It is connected
to the serial port. Is there a certain program that facilitates
the communication?

New(er) SICK Sensors

LeenSTL — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 10:28:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

What are the prices for Urban Challenge teams?

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 08:46:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

The recent announcement regarding 'no prize money' could make an open source project more interesting for those of us who contemplated the track B entry, (and are primarily motivated by the challenge itself). Writing code is the biggest part of this effort and if we could get enough people to contribute, it would level the playing field against the big boys on track A.
We'll file a track B application to keep this option open. Ivar S. team CyberRider.

Track B Funding?

Bill — Wed, 04 Oct 2006 08:22:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

You are correct in Track B being out of luck. We withdrew last month when our support backed out while watching the senate hearings. We have been designing construction ARVs for a few years and could not quailify for Track A.

Track B Funding?

doorsxp — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 12:16:00 GMT

Posted by: doorsxp to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

No prize money? Ridiculous. Might as well just consolidate Track A teams into contractors for the actual military supply missions and save the trouble of staging an event. What a washout!

Track B Funding?

DaveB — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 10:41:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

To get the above link to work, delete the space before "challenge" (needed on this site because it automatically adds spaces)

Track B Funding?

westcoastwatch — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 07:40:00 GMT

Posted by: westcoastwatch to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

Assumed prize money authorization was not going to be extended - what are you talking about? DARPA originally announced the competition with a statement about prize money - three main prizes (2 million, 500 thou, and 250 thou plus incentive prizes for Track B participants who were accepted into the NQE ($50,000) and then into the competition itself ($100,000). They attracted 250 people to their workshop in Washington based on these carrots. Then they "announced" at that workshop that there might not be any prizes, but they were working on it. I understand they only learned about the wording in the bill about two days before the workshop. It was stated that the situation would be "resolved" one way or another over the summer. The Track A awardees were supposed to be announced in September - the announcement was made on Oct 2nd. I suspect that part of the delay was due to an attempt to get congressional approval for the prize money. So now without making a formal statement about the change, they simply ignore the original PR, yet they leave it up on their site since it is a mmatter of record. I suggest that there will only be 11 teams entered into the event as it is very difficult to raise sposnsorship support without the incentive of a monetary prize at the end. Those who waited for Track B are out of luck. Those who entered Track A and were not selected are also out of luck.
The NASA Centennial Challenges suddenly look much more attractive.

Track B Funding?

DGC Vet — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 04:25:00 GMT

Posted by: DGC Vet to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

The 10/2 article on cnn.com about the UGC mentioned the top 3 prizes: $2M, $500K and $250K. It also states that other teams (Track B) will not be "subsidized". http://www.cnn.com/2006/TECH/10/02/robot. challenge.ap/index.html
My team applied for Track A and did not make the cut after we competed in the first 2 Challenges.

[Edited on 10/3/2006]

Track B Funding?

kayakmike — Tue, 03 Oct 2006 01:13:00 GMT

Posted by: kayakmike to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

I don't think anyone assumed prize money authorization was going to be extended (at least we didn't). In fact, we assumed it was non-existent until we heard that authorization would be extended.

DARPA didn't arbitrarily set the event to late October - early November. They knew when funding was going to expire. If authorization was not extended, then DARPA saved themselves $2.75 million.

Regardless, DARPA always reserved the right to change the rules at any point in the competition. Prize money could have disappeared at any time. For that matter, prize money could re-appear at any time also (hypothetically). Or the entire event could be cancelled.

Don't count on the event date to change. There are 11 well funded teams that would complain if their contract/grant were jeopardized by a compressed schedule. 11 DARPA supported teams will have much more influence on DARPA than teams that DARPA did not deem worthy enough for funding.

The interesting point I've noticed is that the removal of prize money was quietly revealed without any mention in today's press release. AP is running a story how 11 teams are competing for prize money. That significant tid-bit wasn't mentioned in the press release.

Track B Funding?

westcoastwatch — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 10:18:00 GMT

Posted by: westcoastwatch to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

We have been told categorically that DARPA will not be making any prize money awards to anyone who competes - neither Track A nor Track B. Not sure why anyone who didn't get a DARPA Grant under Track A would want to participate. Furthermore the fact that there are several documents on the site that state there will be prize money appears to me to be contradictory and perhaps illegal. How many people attended the workshop in Washington under the assumption that significant prize money would be awarded?

Seems like a misrepresentation to me!

New(er) SICK Sensors

Jeff_Wuendry_SICK — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 10:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Jeff_Wuendry_SICK to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

Hi Jon,
I'll briefly describe the 2-D TOF products that SICK is offering for the 2007 DARPA Urban Challenge.

(1018028) LMS291-S05 180 degree FOV, 30m @ 10% reflectivity, 75 Hz scan frequency, 0.25-0.5-1.0 adjustable angular resolution (53.3-26.6,13.3 ms time base) 38.4 and 500kB serial

(1025329) LMS291-S14 same as above except: 90 degree FOV, 0.5 fixed angular resolution, 13.3 ms fixed time base

(1028941) LD-LRS1000 360 FOV, 80m @ 10%, 5-10Hz scan, 0.125-1.5 angular resolution, Ethernet, CAN, RS-232

LD-OEM is a general platform for the LD series. LD-Galileo was the pre-production name for the LD-LRS.

Jeff

Track B Funding?

Dan — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 09:57:00 GMT

Posted by: Dan to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

On slide 10 of the participants conference slides, it says that DARPA's prize authority expires on "September 30, 2007 (End of Fiscal Year 2007)". I think most teams would be willing to give up a month of development time if the race was held on Saturday, September 29, 2007 instead of Nov 3, 2007, if it meant that the race could be held for prizes instead of trophies. That possibility was briefly mentioned at the conference, but, of course, we all assumed the prize authority would be extended.

Track B Funding?

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 06:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

The FAQ list seems to conflict with the latest Rules. Hmmmm.

Track B Funding?

DaveB — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 05:51:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

Notice that they also posted a couple new FAQ lists on the FAQ page

Track B Funding?

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 05:32:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

Based on Darpa's communication today, it looks like the track B teams are on their own. No 50k for semifinalists and finalists. No prize money. A Trophy is nice, but not a great carrot for an all volunteer team. Ivar S.

Looking to purchase an already converted vehicle

LeenSTL — Mon, 02 Oct 2006 05:02:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Vendor/Suppliers:Looking to purchase an already converted vehicle

There have been several posted on Ebay in the time since the site visits were over in June 2005. Team Spurrier was selling a smallish SUV last year then cancelled when they got a 2nd site visit. These things don't sell very often, so it might be worth your looking them up.

Another team in Buffalo tried to sell their ATV based vehicle on Ebay but an ATV is not usable as the primary vehicle for the UC.

Good luck!

Women in Software website

evie — Sat, 30 Sep 2006 11:28:00 GMT

Posted by: evie to Media:Women in Software website

Women in Software is a website dedicated to the promotion of women in software engineering in the U.S.

We are interested in interviewing women who are involved in the Urban Challenge. For expressions of interest please email me at admin@womeninsoftware.com . to view our new website please go to http://www.womeninsoftware.com our message board can be accessed at http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/mb/vip er

thank you for your hospitality on this message board and good luck to all the contestants.

Best,
Evelyn Smith
Women in Software

Archytas wooden pigeon

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Sat, 30 Sep 2006 06:32:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Miscellaneous:Archytas wooden pigeon

Thanks for the helpful hints. Her research also concluded that it most likely used some form of 'rocket propulsion'. We are tempted to build a prototype using a copper reaction chamber into which we suspend a waterbaloon. The reactionchamber is then partially enclosed in a bird carved out of wood which in turn is suspended on a wire. The metal is then heated with a fixed blowtorch, we step back and watch what happens. (The test should probably be conducted outdoors).. Ivar

Looking for Team Leader

arturomdn — Fri, 29 Sep 2006 04:25:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Teaming:Looking for Team Leader

I know someone that is a native Spanish speaker, a US citizen, US resident, has a vehicle that competed in the 2005 National Qualification Event, has 27 years of programming experience, and needs funding... check your email :D

IMU's

Jon — Thu, 28 Sep 2006 11:31:00 GMT

Posted by: Jon to Technology:IMU's

A few more to think about:

Honeywell makes nice, albeit expensive, IMU's. Like $10k+ expensive.
Crista makes a decent MEMS IMU (~$2000).
O-Navi makes some decent MEMS IMU and GPS/INS systems. ($500 - $5000)

-Jon

New(er) SICK Sensors

Jon — Thu, 28 Sep 2006 11:22:00 GMT

Posted by: Jon to Technology:New(er) SICK Sensors

So I'm curious...has anyone yet tried out the LD-LRS, LD-OEM, or LD-Galileo?

What are your experiences? Good? Bad? Ugly? Device lockups or resets?

-Jon

Looking for Team Leader

Mexico — Thu, 28 Sep 2006 04:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Mexico to Teaming:Looking for Team Leader

My name is Hector Ortiz, I am working in the creation of the Mexican Team.

We needed a Team Leader to fulfill the requirements. If yor are interested please write to hector.ortiz@grandchallenge.org.mx

Spanish speaking is a plus :D

Archytas wooden pigeon

Militoy — Wed, 27 Sep 2006 11:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Miscellaneous:Archytas wooden pigeon

There is quite a bit of info published on Archytas' pigeon - Google Scholar is one good source. Most sites identify it as an aeolipile. Being a rocket-type project, I suspect that building and demonstrating a working model would be out of the question. I would gather as much info from Google Scholar as I could, and from that point on, let your daughter use her imagination. After all, her guess as to its actual shape may be as good as any other would-be historian's!

IMU's

Militoy — Wed, 27 Sep 2006 04:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:IMU's

If keeping the system price down is more important than absolute precision, you’re likely looking at a MEMS system, rather than a fiber-optic based one. PC Flight Systems, MEMSense, and Xsens all have MEMS IMU’s available. Just make sure the Kalman Filter algorithm used is set up for a ground vehicle, rather than for flight dynamics.

IMU's

ptrep — Wed, 27 Sep 2006 03:27:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Technology:IMU's

What's your budget? My idea of reasonable price may be very different from yours.

IMU's

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Mon, 25 Sep 2006 07:53:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Technology:IMU's

Any suggestions for a cost effective (read reasonalbly priced) IMU?

Thanks

Ivar (team CyberRider)

Any vehicles from last year for sale?

Mark Fiala — Mon, 25 Sep 2006 01:18:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark Fiala to Teaming:Any vehicles from last year for sale?

Hello,

Does anyone have a vehicle from last year that they aren't using and want to sell? We don't want to perform the conversion to computer control ourselves and are looking for an already converted vehicle. If your vehicle was built for a previous year and not competing this year, give it a new life and sell it to us this year!

Thanks,
Mark

Looking to purchase an already converted vehicle

Mark Fiala — Mon, 25 Sep 2006 01:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark Fiala to Vendor/Suppliers:Looking to purchase an already converted vehicle

Hi,

Our team is investigating the possibility of purchasing an entire vehicle that is already converted to computer control, as that we want to concentrate on the sensors and navigation.

We are looking for possible vendors of this equipment that may already have an integrated vehicle for sale, or from a team from previous years that is not fielding a team this year that already has a vehicle converted.

Thanks,
Mark

Lane Detection System for Autonomous Vehicles

AutoCommute — Mon, 18 Sep 2006 02:22:00 GMT

Posted by: AutoCommute to Vendor/Suppliers:Lane Detection System for Autonomous Vehicles

AutoCommute is making our Lane Detection System available to DARPA Urban Challenge teams. Developed specifically for urban navigation, our system detects lane markings such as lane markers, cross walks and stop lines.

The Lane Detection System can be used with human drivers to provide lane departure warnings, or can be used with autonomous systems to provide lane marking positions with respect to vehicle position for precise vehicle navigation.

We realize that one size doesn’t fit all for this type of system, so sensor arrangements can be customized to each team’s needs.

Information on the system is available on our web site (http://www.autocommute.com/LDS.htm). Feel free to contact us for additional information based on your team’s specific needs.

Yours sincerely,

AutoCommute
info@autocommute.com

[Edited on 9/18/2006]

Archytas wooden pigeon

Steve — Sat, 16 Sep 2006 02:45:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:Archytas wooden pigeon

I do not know that the shape is the important point, but NASA seems to have the clearest description that I found.

http://quest.arc.nasa.gov/space/teachers/ rockets/history.html

However, if you search on the Archytas, everyone seems to have a different description of what he flew. Some say a clay pigeon. NASA in particular indicates a wooden pigeon. One said it was probably a kite (though that site seems alone in that opinion). Most do say it was steam powered and and flew on a suspended wire (i.e. it propelled itself, but did not actually fly in the conventional sense) and could fly several hundred yards. But I do not think anyone actually knows what it looked like as the description comes from an author 300 years after the event.

I do not know that that gives you any more then you already had, but good luck.

Archytas wooden pigeon

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Fri, 15 Sep 2006 07:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Miscellaneous:Archytas wooden pigeon

Maybe one of the clever readers can help with this: My daughter has a school project (6th grade) which consists of reconstructing Archyta's wooden pigeon. (ancient autonomous flying machine). I cannot even find a sketch of what it might have looked like. Any ideas? Ivar S team CyberRider.

VIDEOptions

Andrew May — Thu, 14 Sep 2006 02:34:00 GMT

Posted by: Andrew May to Vendor/Suppliers:VIDEOptions

Can you supply just a radar sensor suite?

Navtech Electronics Ltd

Andrew May — Thu, 14 Sep 2006 02:32:00 GMT

Posted by: Andrew May to Vendor/Suppliers:Navtech Electronics Ltd

Can you provide microwave radar?

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Trevor Brown — Thu, 07 Sep 2006 11:48:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

The Sand Storm team also? I did not think you could be on
more then one team. I guess some can just get around.

I have looked over may places on the web and found some noble efforts, code snippets, cool videos, and even some
references of teams selling their vehicles on Ebay, but no real complete example system. The best spot I have been able to find for any real technical data that might be useful are the published Technical Reports.
They are all very scholarly and interesting but they mostly contain
just overviews of the designs and no real specifics on implementation. Cant
says I blame them with two million dollars at stake after all. Perhaps that is
the crux of the problem and why there is no Open Source entry as yet.

Trevor

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Militoy — Thu, 07 Sep 2006 10:31:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

I hadn't heard of a "Sand Storm" team, and wasn't trying to make that connection - I was referring to a local buggy shop (Sandstormers) that has supported or sponsored both teams. Since both teams also listed as a sponser the ultralight aircraft company where Rjunkworks was located - I am making a wild guess that Rjunkworks has been reorganized into a new team. As far as Open Source entry goes - I can't imagine any team that puts in a serious effort will willingly share their best ideas with prospective competitors. We view this competition the way we view any conventional race - You spend $4 million, for a chance to win $2 million and a shot at $20 million in contracts.

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Militoy — Tue, 05 Sep 2006 12:41:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I would direct you to our own website, but the chargers we make are for military applications only – quite expensive and not usually available in lots of less than 10. You might consider using a multi-winding dual-voltage alternator like those made by MBP, or even a 24V input inverter, like a Dimensions Unlimited model, running a 12V 3-state charger. Dimensions even makes models with smart chargers built-in - I'll bet they would be willing to build you a 24V model, with a 12V charger wired up to the inverter output.

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Militoy — Tue, 05 Sep 2006 10:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Trevor - How far did KNetX get with the buggy design? The last time I checked into their stuff, they were still running the pickup under the team name Rjunkworks - and the buggy was at Sandstormers' previous location, getting painted. I had planned to visit their shop - but got involved with a different entry, and wanted to avoid any conflict of interest.

Roboteq Support Program to 2007 Grand Challengers

roboteq — Mon, 04 Sep 2006 04:00:00 GMT

Posted by: roboteq to Vendor/Suppliers:Roboteq Support Program to 2007 Grand Challengers

Roboteq is glad to renew its special discount on our family of Motor Controllers to Grand Challenge 2007 participants. Please visit www.roboteq.com/grandchallenge2007.html for program details.

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Jassper — Wed, 30 Aug 2006 09:14:00 GMT

Posted by: Jassper to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Militoy - Thanks for the heads up, but I already know that and I have taken it into account. Right now I just need to know if it is possible to use the 24volt alt to charge the 12volt batteries. You speak of a 3 stage charger that can take the 24volt input and charge at 12volt. Can you provide a link? This type of charger I have not been able to find - or I'm looking in the wrong places.

The "cartoon" is just a simplified diagram of the system. The currect 24volt system is regulated by a 3 stag alternator regulator, If I can use the same alternator to charge the AGMs without effecting the current system, then I would use appropriate means to protect the AGMs.

Thanks

[Edited on 8/30/2006]

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Militoy — Wed, 30 Aug 2006 04:36:00 GMT

Posted by: Militoy to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I haven’t had a chance to look over the cartoon of your system, but here are a few notes on your charging issue:
AGM batteries need to be charged using a different set of current/voltage/temperature parameters than flooded lead-acid or gel cells. Simply bulk charging them like you might a flooded lead-acid bank can cause AGM batteries to explode under certain (unfortunate) circumstances. Charging cycles should be controlled in accordance with the battery manufacturer’s recommendations. The safest way to charge AGMs, and to assure their long life, is to use a 3 or 4-state charger, with temperature monitoring of your battery bank. The charger should be set up for "undercharge", "bulk charge", "overcharge" (optional), and "float charge". Look for a 3 or 4-state 12V charger that’s programmable for AGMs, and set up to run off of 24V. There should be commercial versions available (ours are for military applications, and fairly expensive). You will save $ if you undersize the charger capacity a bit, and put up with a slower charge rate.

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Jassper — Mon, 28 Aug 2006 06:54:00 GMT

Posted by: Jassper to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

I added the battereis that we want to add to the drawing. Let me know if you need more information.

Thanks

Attachments:

H3-45 Chargeing system.dwf (1Kb)

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

DaveB — Sun, 27 Aug 2006 12:34:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Thoughts

The alternator must charge the batteries while delivering full load

Charging load might be eliminated by precharging batteries,
but then why would you need such large batteries?

200 A of 12 V uses only abt 100 A from the 24 V system

24 V equipment is smaller, & uses smaller wires than 12 V (1/2 the amps)
Could you change any of your load to 24 V?

The only reason for separate batteries is usually to reserve power
to start the motor -- a battery that won't be drained by "hotel" load.

It's a bad idea, for battery life, to charge at more than half its capacity.
That is, don't charge a 100 A Hr battery at more than 50 A

Complicated battery networks can make the above difficult to prevent.

If you're sure the alternator is 270 A at 24 V, it's probably plenty big enough,
but if it were actually 12 V, and used the equalizer to power the 24 V, then maybe not.

Equalizers, like inverters, use electronics that fail if overloaded, and sometimes if not,
so a more reliable system may be to add a 12 V alternator, and simplify the battery network

You could upload that schematic by clicking the "Attach File" button at the top of the window,
or just describe it, e.g. "24 V alternator to two batteries in series. 24-12 V equalizer from 24 V
to two batteries in parallel. 20 A of 24 V load. 50 A of 12 V load.

Why DO you need such large batteries?

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Jassper — Sun, 27 Aug 2006 09:21:00 GMT

Posted by: Jassper to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

We are adding (6) 12 volt 8D AGM type batteries rated at 255 Ahr for a total of 1530 Amp hours. The main charging will be from two 2500 watt inverter/chargers each capable of charging at 125 amps. Why so much power? Because our clientele does not know the meaning of "power conservation". They expect to be able to run everything regardless if they are driving, plugged into shore, or dry camping. My main concern is the fact that one of the (3) 1500btu air conditioners can be used while driving. The Air conditioner pulls about 18 amps AC while cooling. This equates to 180 amps DC at a 10:1 ratio out of the inverters. I realize not much charge will actually be going into the batteries and we will be using a Drop out relay to disconnect the Air Conditioner if the battery voltage becomes to low. The Inverters are also backed up by a 20Kwh diesel generator, if the power consumption is above a set point for an extended time the generator automatically starts – IF the customer has turned that feature on. Why the customers won't use the generator to run all 3 airs while driving is beyond my understanding of the rice and famous.

I don't have the schematics with me. I will get them on Monday and attach them along with other specifications and show what we want to do to the system. I have attached a simple drawing of the basic configuration. I'll post more info tomorrow. Thanks again

Jassper

Attachments:

H3-45 Chargeing system.dwf (1Kb)

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

sapper023 — Sat, 26 Aug 2006 11:17:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

A rough note sorry if I skip around on subjects .
This is a common upgrade problem of recreational vehical , vehical computer instalation , large robot desighns ( mine at least ) and car sterio power systems and your proposed idea may work in a few situations but may be troublsome if the system is not understood before upgrade so you are wise to ask around .
Without a schimatic of your system and proposed system I would hesitate to comment as there are several issues of charging system style , safety , economy and practicality .
I also would not load an alternator more if the power plant was desighned to have that alternator as there is a general mechanic practice of using large alternators to offset heat and peak load requirements issues and may need a wider belt or more belts and/or cooling and/or external diodes to actualy deliver full ratings .
If you do not want me to evaluate your system take your system to a recreational vehical or industrial truck wiring specialist and request quotes or information on your alternatives , as there are manual and automatic systems to choose from as well as lifespan and matinance issues they could also see if there will be belt and heat issues as it could take me a month to find my reference material on belts and pullies .
Could you provide a schematic of your system as I may only need a paragraph for response for the electrical issues .

Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Jassper — Fri, 25 Aug 2006 10:16:00 GMT

Posted by: Jassper to Miscellaneous:Charge 12 volt batteries from 24 volt source

Not really related to the Grand Challenge, but who better to ask than you guys!

Situation:
I have a 24 volt 270amp Delco alternator driven by a series 60 diesel engine. Now it is connected to the chassis system which is a 24 volt system, Four 12volt batteries wired in series-parallel for a 24volt bank using a 100amp Equalizer. The chassis system only requires about 60 to 70 amps, leaving me with about 200 amps unused. I have a second "House" system of Six 8D 12 volt AGM batteries wired in parallel, this system could demand up to 200 amps +.

Question:
I've never seen this done, but - Can I use the 24 volt alternator to charge the 12 volt batteries? I know the equalizer already splits it into 12 and 24 to charge the chassis batteries, would changing the 100 amp Equalizer to a 300 amp allow me to tap off the 12volt side to charge the house batteries? The House would be a much larger draw so I'm thinking that this would over load the chassis batteries.

Is there a way I can take advantage of this over size 24 volt alternator to charge a bank of 12 volt batteries?

Thanks

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Trevor Brown — Tue, 22 Aug 2006 08:24:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

I was doing some research for open code and its
applicability to the Grand Challenge when I came across this and this. I read that team KNetX was part of the last Grand Challenge
and their sand buggy looks pretty neat.
I read some interesting stuff that the Travis Wood guy has written about computer
vision and the Grand Challenge and it’s pretty interesting.

Trevor

test an autonomous vehicle in simulated urban traffic

Christophe Hamel — Mon, 21 Aug 2006 11:54:00 GMT

Posted by: Christophe Hamel to Vendor/Suppliers:test an autonomous vehicle in simulated urban traffic

We produce a driving simulator software program called SCANeRII which might be valuable in the
context of testing your autonomous vehicle.

It's a program which is capable of programming urban traffic behaviour
(www.scaner2.com ). SCANeRII is already in use by certain research labs (human factor and road safety) organisations working in the field of intelligent transportation.

I hope this is relevant to this particular Challenge or to other such applications.

Yours sincerely,

Christophe HAMEL
Sales area export manager

OKTAL SA
8, rue de la ferme
92100 BOULOGNE BILLANCOURT
FRANCE

Phone: +33 (0)146 949 828
Fax: +33 (0) 1 41 419 144
SCANeR Web Site: www.scaner2.com

Attachments:

SCANeR-recto.jpg (1017Kb)

SCANeR-verso.jpg (1124Kb)

CMU H1ghlander's Inspired Tony Scott for New Movie Deja Vu

chemistpgh — Mon, 21 Aug 2006 08:54:00 GMT

Posted by: chemistpgh to Miscellaneous:CMU H1ghlander's Inspired Tony Scott for New Movie Deja Vu

Jump online and view a preview of the new Denzel Washington movie Deja va...you will see him driving a replica of H1lander complete with SICKS, gimbal dome, stickers, etc. The computer rack even appears to be behind him. There is speculation that the vehicle is a time machine in the movie. I suppose a vehicle driving itself is. Unfortunately Denzel appears to be doing most of the work.

Links to just the picture of the vehicles:

http://redteamracing.org/galleries/55/2EC 2F8FA-559C-4A8C-842DFA7EA718ACD0_IMAGE.jp g

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/804/de gavugr7.jpg

Links to full trailer/more angles:

http://movies.yahoo.com/mv/mf/frame?theme =minfo&lid=qtv-56-p.1444940-168896,qt v-100-p.1444941-168896,qtv-300-p.1444942-1 68896,qtv-700-p.1444943-168896,wmv-56-p.1 444944-168896,wmv-100-p.1444945-168896,wm v-300-p.1444946-168896,wmv-700-p.1444947-1 68896,qtv-28-p.1444940-168896,wmv-28-p.14 44944-168896&id=1809275011&f=1809 275011&mspid=1809721082&type=t

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

ACfishing — Fri, 18 Aug 2006 12:18:00 GMT

Posted by: ACfishing to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Where can I enter and find out about this competition?

[Edited on 8/18/2006]

Track B Funding?

DGC Vet — Wed, 16 Aug 2006 08:41:00 GMT

Posted by: DGC Vet to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

I believe the House and Senate bills have passed and are awaiting reconciliation after the congress returns from their summer recess. I believe DARPA's overall appropriation has been increased in both bills but the line item for "land warfare" was decreased. I'm not sure what this means for the Urban Challenge but DARPA has already made some decisions on track A entrants (both up and down), so they are moving ahead.
Al

OBD2 vehicle data acquisition - J2534, CAN, J1850, ISO9141, SCI, etc

Brian — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 11:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Brian to Vendor/Suppliers:OBD2 vehicle data acquisition - J2534, CAN, J1850, ISO9141, SCI, etc

We supply a variety of products to communicate with onboard computers in newer automobiles, heavy duty trucks, off road vehicles, and CAN in avation and aerospace. The CarDAQ-DV features embedded Linux on a 200MHZ processor, built-in wireless, wired ethernet, and support for all J2534-1 protocols including ISO15765 (CAN), J1850PWM (Ford SCP), J1850VPW (GM Class 2), ISO9141 (KWP2000), and Chrysler SCI. The embedded Linux platform allows developers to host applications on the CarDAQ-DV so it can operate without a PC connected. The CarDAQ-Plus has all of that functionality and adds 8 high resolution analog inputs, USB, J1939/J1708 suport, and two Compact Flash slots for the addition of up to 4GB of memory, GPS, or cellular modems.

Drew Technologies also has a licensable enhanced data library and API for 3rd party integration. The library and API allow programers to easily integrate vehicle data into their existing application without knowing automotive-specific protocols and diagnostics. This product will allow you to log events that happen on the vehicle bus, perform diagnostics, and collect real time paramaters such as PIDs, DPIDS, and DMRs from the automobile such as speed, rpm, ABS brake status, drive-by-wire sterring data, and more.

www.drewtech.com
bherron@drewtech.com

Track B Funding?

Igor — Tue, 15 Aug 2006 03:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Igor to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

It looks like this is an issue between a House bill and a Senate bill which do not have the same language. I am reluctanct to use a government sponsored bulletin board to discuss a potential lobbying subject. I could set up a blog on the issue (with more details) if there is any interest from the rest of the crowd (e-mail me at: igorcarron@gmail.com ) so we could have concerted effort on this issue.

Igor.
http://www.pegasus-bridge.com/

ELROB 2006

Bill — Mon, 14 Aug 2006 07:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

Nice answer.

ELROB 2006

sapper023 — Sun, 13 Aug 2006 03:27:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

I do not laugh at you folks for you also need to experiance recovery from mistakes to learn even if you are going down a dead end street , you need to go your own path as you learn .
What is the point of giving you the keys if you do not know what doors you need to open nor how to find the next keys which will be harder for you to find .
I will eventualy get what I need one way or another and then be able to prove my points if any are in dispute at that time if time does not prove my points by then ( I work slowly when I do not have the right tools to do a job ) .

ELROB 2006

sapper023 — Sun, 13 Aug 2006 03:25:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

Put up ? In time I suppose I will understand what that means , clearly I am too stupid about social graces to share with any confidence my discoveries , for fear of the wastful and complex social interactions that accompany any fame sharing may bring .
As for being smart ... well I am the first to admit that I am not verry smart , I had just started a long time ago when people thought my efforts would be wasted because such things were supposedly impossible .
I just make soposedly phenominal progress because I do not fear failure as I am well practaced at recovering from mistakes . My balance of stupidity is in non technical areas that more than make up for any illusion of brilliance others may think I have .
I have no laurals to lend credibility to my statements but I have seen changes that have happened possibly do to my influence on the relevent technologies .
If you want me to put up give me a metal lathe ( my last one was not worth salvaging ) , set me up with a system with which I can program contemporary programmable EPROMS , array logic devices ( I am making things from TTL and CMOS discret logic right now ) .
What is really stupid of me is that I have a robotics hobby that I do not have the means to support and an unreasoning fear of paperwork that prevents me from applying for a research grant .
Laugh at me all you like , I laugh also my whole life seems to be a joke .

2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

LeenSTL — Thu, 10 Aug 2006 03:51:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

I've volunteered to help out, several of us in the St Louis Robotics Club might do a road trip to help out. I would like to encourage others to volunteer also, how often do you get a chance to participate in a ground floor effort like this?

ELROB 2006

RobotGuy — Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:43:00 GMT

Posted by: RobotGuy to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

I wish we could all be as smart as you, Sapper. Put up or shut up, and read TR about the man in the arena.

Self Driving Car

RobotGuy — Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:40:00 GMT

Posted by: RobotGuy to Miscellaneous:Self Driving Car

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

RobotGuy — Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:16:00 GMT

Posted by: RobotGuy to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

More open source robotics software:

http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~carmen/links.html
http://sourceforge.net/project/showfiles. php?group_id=121727
http://sourceforge.net/projects/modutils

A harder course.

RobotGuy — Wed, 09 Aug 2006 09:06:00 GMT

Posted by: RobotGuy to Technology:A harder course.

SICKs have their issues, but they are an order of magnitude cheaper than similarly capable sensors. Some of the teams (Stanford, CMU, Perceptek) have been using SICKs for years and have them pretty well down. The "dazzle" bit is a perfect example of how people in the know had no problems and people out of the know struggled mightily. Don't hesitate to ask these kinds of questions on the discussion boards as you can usually get answers from the old hands (particularly at the Universities).

New FAQ Responses

RobotGuy — Wed, 09 Aug 2006 07:51:00 GMT

Posted by: RobotGuy to Rules:New FAQ Responses

Being street-legal isn't enough because this is a race. Moreover, it is like a race driven by chimps. Race vehicles are often expected to have additional safety measures, and DARPA is correct in requiring the same here. I can see why they are interested in non-chassis upgrades. For instance, Red Team's H1ghlander used a custom hydraulic steering system. Hydraulic steering is now used in some trucks but is illegal in several states. Electric drivetrains, hydraulic steering, and custom fuel tanks all could make the drive-by-wire problem easier, but introduce new safety issues. Ideally DARPA would let teams make any modifications then perform a safety inspection, but DARPA doesn't have the expertise for that.

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

sapper023 — Sat, 05 Aug 2006 12:20:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

You say "competition" , what is the URL that describes the ' prize ' and qualifications to meet?
I do not understand DARPA paying for a white paper but I do understand making some thing that wins a competition by being better than a minimum specification .
More over I would like a list of prizes specifications and time lines so that I can develop a schedual for sequencing shop capability/upgrade that will intercept DARPA needs for my and shop revenue .
I would like to get into the game of ' agile innovation of systems ' for prizes but would rather have others handle production , patents and sales .
Those items indicated in this forum seem simple to me to make .

I do not have EMail except messages through my myspace page

http://www.myspace.com/sapper023

[Edited on 8/5/2006]

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Bill — Sat, 05 Aug 2006 11:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Ah yes straight out of BattleTech. To bad it can not walk. We have been working on this for years part time, not easy.

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Trevor Brown — Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

This and this are rather cool as well.

Trevor

[Edited on 8/3/2006]

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Trevor Brown — Thu, 03 Aug 2006 11:38:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

This is not exactly Little Dog, but its legged, kind of, sort of. My 5 year old son thinks its something out of
Power Rangers. I especially like the paint-ball-space-invader shooting gun. I
know I would freak out if I was an enemy and saw something like that coming at
me on the battle field!

Trevor

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

mlinder — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 09:45:00 GMT

Posted by: mlinder to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Patrick,
How hard would it be to modify your software to recognize things like double yellow lines, or the size and distance of vehicles being followed? For that matter really anything that may be of use to the teams. I know many teams would be interested in getting something like that "off the shelf"

Matt

INS+GPS for Urban Environments from Oxford Technical Solutions

OxfordTechnicalSolutions — Wed, 26 Jul 2006 08:00:00 GMT

Posted by: OxfordTechnicalSolutions to Vendor/Suppliers:INS+GPS for Urban Environments from Oxford Technical Solutions

Navigation in Urban environments is challenging. But new features in our Inertial Navigation Systems (INS) make it simple and reliable:

* RT3000 algorithms used successfully by Gray, Terramax and CajunBot in the last GC

* Urban/Indoor Tracking GPS, so you will almost always have GPS

* Wheel speed input for dead-reckoning if GPS is unavailable

* Terrain Feature Updating - recognize features from the Route Network Definition File (stop signs, road edges) using vision/radar etc., send them to the INS and it updates the outputs, keeping you accurate for long periods of time even without GPS

* Quick operational capability, with installation, calibration and training completed in hours (not days)

Plus, this will be our lowest priced system

See www.oxts.com/option.asp?active_page_id=13 3
Contact Brent Rijnovean brent@brendelassociates.com
M: (313) 729-9898
T: (313) 278-1872

Background

Oxford Technical Solutions has been making commercial INS with GPS since 1998, has supplied nearly 200 systems worldwide and has a keen interest in Autonomous programs. We have supplied INS to many Autonomous programs such as the DARPA Grand Challenge, ABD Autonomous Robots, Volkswagen for their autonomous Golf 53+1 (just announced) plus several other car manufacturers.

[Edited on 7/26/2006]

Active Silicon Frame Grabber PCI Cards For Sale

AutoCommute — Sun, 23 Jul 2006 06:01:00 GMT

Posted by: AutoCommute to Miscellaneous:Active Silicon Frame Grabber PCI Cards For Sale

We have 3 Active Silicon frame grabber PCI cards for sale.

One was used for Autonomous Vehicle System's
2005 DGC entry last year and the other two are new or very lightly
used. These are high end real-time capture cards with 4 BNC input
sources or 2 S-video sources simultaneously. We also have 1 of
their 4 BNC to 2 S-Video adapter, plus another one that had the S-video
ends cut off (4 BNC to bare wire). Will also provide Active Silicon software we have
downloaded (Windows/Linux drivers, Software Development Kit).

Full data sheet available here:

http://www.activesilicon.co.uk/pdfs/as-lf g4-pci64-us.pdf

Send e-mail to info (at) autocommute (dot) com if you are interested or have any questions.

Thanks,

Mike

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

LeenSTL — Sun, 23 Jul 2006 05:23:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

In a real world scenario your product might be of use, but for this competiton in a "simulated urban environment" I think the route files must be followed.
The rules specify that route files (plus any data which can be derived from supplied maps etc) will be used, ie, existing signage may or not match the route files but the route files trump existing signage / street markings etc. This gives DARPA the flexibility to create their "simulated urban environment" on an existing training site or similar without having to have any signage present at all.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Patrick Andrews — Fri, 21 Jul 2006 10:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Patrick Andrews to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

It seems to me that one of the main challenges for autonomous vehicles is, rightly, to be able to use existing road signage.
We have made this suggestion in connection with our software product SceneReader which is mentioned in the Vendors section (www.scenereader.com)...reliance on GPS or dead reckoning in any real Urban environment will surely not be sufficient/ meaningful?

Interpretation of printed signs in complex scenes: SceneReader software

Patrick Andrews — Fri, 21 Jul 2006 10:40:00 GMT

Posted by: Patrick Andrews to Vendor/Suppliers:Interpretation of printed signs in complex scenes: SceneReader software

We produce a software program called SceneReader which might be valuable in the
context of urban navigation.

It's a program which is uniquely capable of reading words within complex images
(www.scenereader.com ). SceneReader is already in use by certain commercial
organisations working in the field of intelligent transportation.

I hope this is relevant to this particular Challenge or to other such applications.

Yours sincerely,
Patrick Andrews

--
Managing Director
break-step productions ltd.
www.break-step.com

Email: pra@break-step.com

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Trevor Brown — Wed, 19 Jul 2006 12:41:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

I did find this robot

I want one!

Trevor

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Trevor Brown — Wed, 19 Jul 2006 01:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

Actually, that was their BigDog. Here is there LittleDog. The video for it is not as nifty, maybe its the music. Boston Dynamics looks like a really cool place to work at.

Trevor

MOTORS, GEARMOTORS AND CONTROLS - FROM STOCK

MIDWEST MOTION PRODUCTS — Tue, 18 Jul 2006 06:32:00 GMT

Posted by: MIDWEST MOTION PRODUCTS to Vendor/Suppliers:MOTORS, GEARMOTORS AND CONTROLS - FROM STOCK

Greetings -
This is our first Entry, although we have supplied our Motion Control Products to DARPA Competitors before.
The difference now is that we offer a wide variety of products FROM STOCK, including 12 and 24 Volt DC Gearmotors, Motors, Linear Actuators, and Motor Speed Controls (IP-65 Rated, will accept 0-5 V Command) among other related products.

Two brief documents that summarize our capabilities are attached, FYI..

Anyone wishing a Copy of our "COTS Product Availability Report" is eligible to recieve a copy -- simply respond to the undersigned via email.
Or, if you wish, send your specs and we'll size it up for you.

Please be sure to let me know where you found us.

Best of Luck to you !
Regards,
Randy Cordes,
Midwest Motion Products
www.midwestmotion.com
randy@midwestmotion.com

Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

John Nagle — Mon, 17 Jul 2006 10:59:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Miscellaneous:Who has a team in the DARPA Little Dog competition?

This isn't DARPA's only robotics competition. There's also the "Little Dog" program for
legged robots. (BAA 05-25) Anyone involved with that from a non-university organization?
I know which universities are involved already. Thanks.

Team ATR Is On Thin Ice

Ice — Fri, 14 Jul 2006 12:44:00 GMT

Posted by: Ice to Sponsors:Team ATR Is On Thin Ice

We are the Team ATR, and we need sponsors to support our to accomplish the task in hand. The faith of the whole world is riding on our hand. We are seeking any kind of support. Please, help.

Website: http://www.freewebs.com/advanced-tech/
Contact: setoblader@yahoo.com
Thank You

Need Support

Able — Fri, 14 Jul 2006 12:31:00 GMT

Posted by: Able to Sponsors:Need Support

Team Able, California State University Northridge team, is a combination of students and industry professionals. We need sponsors to support our group to accomplish the task in hand. We are seeking any kind of support. Please, help.

Thank You

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

LeenSTL — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 05:59:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

Yeah I thought your site was great for info, and the story about the $1 bet is a classic. Maybe the third time will be the charm, best of luck!

A harder course.

RJMason — Wed, 12 Jul 2006 04:13:00 GMT

Posted by: RJMason to Technology:A harder course.

We seem to have had a better experience with our Sicks than many other teams did.

Track B Funding?

LeenSTL — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 12:45:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

It was for all funding of prize monies, correct? AFAIK, it affects the winners regardless of the their track, ie, the race might turn out to not have any cash payout to the winners. That is my recollection of what was said by Dr Tether in the conference, there is a transcript online that you can peruse.

A harder course.

ptrep — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 11:21:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Technology:A harder course.

I would be very surprised if someone wins the Urban Challenge with Sicks. Their limited range and wacky behavior, along with the most overly-complicated API I have every seen, all contribute to making them a poor choice for any autonomous vehicle application, especially one as difficult as the Urban Challenge. This is just my two cents. We used them last year, and we finished the race, but using them was like pulling teeth.

A harder course.

RJMason — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 08:33:00 GMT

Posted by: RJMason to Technology:A harder course.

JN: But you're not going to win the Urban Challenge with SICK units. It's time to move up.

I respectfully disagree with John.

Some people said that SICK units were not good enough for the Grand Challenge, but in fact, they were perfectly adequate, as Stanford demonstrated.

SICK units should be even more adequate for the Urban Challenge, with its lower speed limit and mostly-paved environment. In my opinion, the Urban Challenge is not harder, at least not much harder, with respect to sensing. It is much harder with respect to planning. It will be won by the best planner, not necessarily by the best sensor.

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

RJMason — Tue, 11 Jul 2006 07:38:00 GMT

Posted by: RJMason to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

We had on-board cameras, but to our great regret, we did not recover any video from the GCE event. We have ladar images, up to the point where the computer crashed.

Our vehicle was doing very well, on pace to potentially win the race, until we unexpectedly ran out of memory at twenty-two miles. A more detailed write-up is here:
http://www.golemgroup.com/results05.html

Our chase driver said that the robot bouncing over the desert at sixty miles per hour was a remarkable sight. He was also disappointed that we did not get any video.

Self Driving Car

OxfordTechnicalSolutions — Mon, 10 Jul 2006 07:38:00 GMT

Posted by: OxfordTechnicalSolutions to Miscellaneous:Self Driving Car

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/art icles/news/news.html?in_article_id=393401 &in%20_page_id=1770

The navigation system in the VW Golf is an RT3000 series IMU with GPS from Oxford Technical Solutions (OxTS). http://www.oxts.com
Brendel Associates is the US sales and service agent for the RT3000 line. We provided RT units for the 2005 GC to Teams: Gray, TerraMax and CajunBot.
Look for future posts about special features and enhancements that will be of great value for the application and conditions of the 2007 Urban Challenge. Should you have any questions about the RT3000 series, please do not hesitate to contact me.
Brent Rijnovean
Brendel Associates Limited
Mobile: (313) 729-9898
Phone: (313) 278-1872
mailto:brent@brendelassociates.com
http://www.brendelassociates.com

Track B Funding?

Steve — Mon, 10 Jul 2006 07:29:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

I do not know the details of what is going on with this (and I would appreciate updates from DARPA when they have some), but as I have had similar questions I can add this.

1) What was said at the conference (if I remember correctly) was that they MAY have resolved things by the 4th of July.

2) Searching the Senate calender, it appears that starting on the 20th, the Senate is going to start (it is scheduled for at least two days) to vote on amendments to the Defense Appropriations Bill to try to resolve the differences with the House Bill.

3) When I search the House Bill, I cannot (I am not an expert on such things) find anything to do with this event -- but I assume it is buried in there somewhere (perhaps as an attachment).

4) The Congressional appropriations cycle is a long one.

I do not know if this helps, but it is what I could search out.

Track B Funding?

Trevor Brown — Mon, 10 Jul 2006 06:28:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Track B Funding?

Wasn’t there something that was going to be voted on by congress
about track B funding? If I remember correctly the vote was supposed to have
happened by now. I have looked everywhere trying to find what might have happened
and have not been able to locate anything about it. Does anyone know the status
of it?

Trevor

Self Driving Car

DaveB — Fri, 07 Jul 2006 09:49:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Self Driving Car

Yes, Stanley was a VW, but a Touareg rather than a Golf. Maybe Stanford will start with that Golf, this time. Its top speed wouldn't help, but starting with built-in sensors would be cool.

I wish they had a video of that Golf going 150, rather than about 5 mph.

Indiana (hopefully, central)

Flutter Vertigo — Fri, 07 Jul 2006 07:25:00 GMT

Posted by: Flutter Vertigo to Teaming:Indiana (hopefully, central)

I'm in Fishers (just over the NE boundary of Indianapolis).

I was recruited to work on the '05 race led by Scott Jones and Doug Traster. (If you know where Scott's estate is and where to look with Maps.Google, you can still see the jeep's tracks, particularly when the map data has Winter images)

I'm in my mid-40s, so I've got considerable experience in a lot of areas. I also won't be bound to a different schedule when school goes into session, including the fact we have no kids.

When working on the IRV project, we were generally expected to work a minimum of twenty hours per week, but the "Yellow House" (it was a rather large, multi-story yellow house on the corner of Scott's estate) was generally full of people every night of the week as people would hang out there instead of playing games or coding other things at home. i.e., there was a lot of dedication to the project.

Thanks,

phil

Self Driving Car

arturomdn — Thu, 06 Jul 2006 04:47:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Self Driving Car

Trevor, I've had the same problem with the spaces in URL's. One way to get around it is to highlight a word
in your text then click on the "Create Link" tool, then paste the URL in the popup.
I did that for your link here.

Self Driving Car

Trevor Brown — Thu, 06 Jul 2006 01:46:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:Self Driving Car

This is pretty cool:
www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/n ews/news.html?in_article_id=393401&in _page_id=1770
This would be a great car for some team to enter the Urban Challenge with! Was Stanley a VW also?

Trevor
PS
- I can not get the little space out of the URL that is between the "n"
and "e" in "news". ?Dont know why? Just remove it if you cut
and paste the URL.

[Edited on 7/6/2006]

2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

Trevor Brown — Wed, 05 Jul 2006 02:15:00 GMT

Posted by: Trevor Brown to Miscellaneous:2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

The PPRHC event would seem to be by invitation only
driverlessmotorsports.com/pprhc/qa.htm
and run by CMU faculty. The temporary rules are at
driverlessmotorsports.com/pprhc/rules.htm

Trevor

[Edited on 7/5/2006]

2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

LeenSTL — Wed, 05 Jul 2006 01:09:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

Very cool, did you use the same type of waypoint following from the 2005 GC? How will the actual event be run, ie, will there be multiple bots on the course at the same time? Or will it be more like the 2005 GC where each bot is launched separately?

Did your vehicle slide around the curves like this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oywkOzRug Y&mode=related&search=

[Edited on 7/5/2006]

2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

KonaKid — Tue, 04 Jul 2006 05:19:00 GMT

Posted by: KonaKid to Miscellaneous:2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb

Axion Racing announces that on July 2nd, 2006, Spirit became the first autonomously driven vehicle to reach the 14,110 foot top of Colorado's Pike Peak. This was accomplished using advanced sensors, GPS, INS, and AI code. The team's vehicle ran along the same route that will be used for the 2006 Pikes Peak Robot Hill Climb race. The PPRHC will be held on September 23, 2006 and information about this unmatched success is available off Axion Racing's website news section.

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

LeenSTL — Mon, 03 Jul 2006 04:12:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

I'm sure everyone asks this but: did you guys have any video capture on your GC vehicle? How well was your vehicle doing before it got disabled?

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

brianp — Mon, 03 Jul 2006 02:55:00 GMT

Posted by: brianp to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

As other posters have pointed out, the Joint Architecture for Unmanned Systems is there, mature, and I strongly feel that it's the best platform for an open source Entry. The modular nature of JAUS really lends itself to sharing and collaborating on discrete components, perhaps designed specifically for a particular COTS part. Since there is a reference architecture to work from, there isn't a whole lot of room to squabble over design.

The OpenJAUS project is very much alive, with a parent project on sourceforge (http://openjaus.sourceforge.net/). There is a Java implementation available on java.net, which has been successfully deployed. I've also been working diligently on a C JAUS library, but there is still nothing in the sourceforge repository. If there is an interest in sharing and collaborating on JAUS components, I think the OpenJAUS project on sourceforge is an excellent candidate for a base project.

Brian Prodoehl

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

RJMason — Sun, 02 Jul 2006 11:59:00 GMT

Posted by: RJMason to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

DaveB: Not only do I think a Geo Metro could have finished the two off-road challenges, but I doubt it would even have been a disadvantage, but some of those who've actually traveled those courses might disagree.

The first off-road challenge was actually pretty rough in places. I drove it in a serious 4x4 vehicle and at one point I managed to get temporarily stuck. Driving it in a Geo Metro might be theoretically possible, but I think would be a daunting experience even for a human driver.

I did not drive the second off-road course but it was reported to be less challenging.

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 01 Jul 2006 08:16:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

I would like to participate in an open source / common standard program.
Who do I coordinate this effort with?

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.
Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Active Teams?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sat, 01 Jul 2006 07:20:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Active Teams?

AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC will be there with their US Army M215 - #03 AV WENDY DARLING.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

igus Inc. — Fri, 30 Jun 2006 09:33:00 GMT

Posted by: igus Inc. to Sponsors:Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

Seth,

Igus Inc. (www.igus.com) would be more than happy to donate free products to your DARPA team. Please visit www.igus.com/yesprogram to learn about our Y.E.S. (Young Engineers Support) Program. Through Y.E.S., your team can receive free Energy Chain cable carrier, Chainflex continuous-flex cable and iglide plastic bearings. Please contact me via e-mail at ctoomey@igus.com with any questions or view our posting located on the sponsors page of the DARPA website.

Best,
Courtney Toomey
Y.E.S. Program Administrator

igus® Inc. donates FREE products to DARPA participants!

igus Inc. — Fri, 30 Jun 2006 09:28:00 GMT

Posted by: igus Inc. to Sponsors:igus® Inc. donates FREE products to DARPA participants!

Participating in the DARPA Grand Challenge?
Igus Inc., the leading developer of Energy Chain cable carriers, Chainflex continuous-flex cables and iglide plastic bearings, wants to help! Igus’ Y.E.S. (Young Engineers Support) Program fosters the mechanical design ideas of students/engineers and educates them on the merits and benefits of plastic components. Through Y.E.S., teams like yours can receive FREE product donations!

Please read the attached document for more information or e-mail Courtney Toomey at ctoomey@igus.com.

To search for products, visit www.igus.com.
To request product donations, visit www.igus.com/yesprogram.

[Edited on 6/30/2006]

Attachments:

igus_sponsors_DARPA.doc (27Kb)

Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

ptrep — Thu, 29 Jun 2006 10:39:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Vendor/Suppliers:Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

Oxford Technical Solutions also makes a killer integrated GPS/INS that was used by Team Gray, Terramax, and Cajunbot.

Active Teams?

ptrep — Thu, 29 Jun 2006 10:37:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Teaming:Active Teams?

Team Gray will be there.

Active Teams?

Nelson Bridwell — Thu, 29 Jun 2006 09:05:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Teaming:Active Teams?

I just looked over the websites for the 2005 teams. Here is a summary of what I could found regarding 2007 participation:

Axion Racing - submitted track A proposal.
Insight Racing - plans to compete
CMU - plans to compete (not yet reflected on website)
Stanford - plans to compete
CalTech - interested in competing
Cornell - plans to compete
Austin Robot Technology - attended participants conference
CyberRyder - looking for funding
Oregon Wave - interested in competing
Tormenta - plans to compete

There are quite a few other teams that have not yet updated their websites since the 2005 DGC, but presumably are worlking on the 2007 Urban Challenge.

[Edited on 6/29/2006]

Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

John Nagle — Thu, 29 Jun 2006 02:47:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Vendor/Suppliers:Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

Spend the money and buy this, or the comparable Novatel system. You need the fibre optic heading gyro and the high precision inertial system. We (Team Overbot) went to the Grand Challenge with a lower-grade INS and no fibre optic heading gyro, and the 2 degree error from the lower grade systems was enough to cause serious problems. If you saw our runs, where the vehicle would try to get through a tight spot, stop, back up, reposition, and eventually get through, that was why - our heading info was just slightly off. That problem can be solved by throwing money at the problem.

Orphans

wolfbob — Tue, 27 Jun 2006 12:35:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Orphans

The California code is:

21460. (a) When double parallel solid lines are in place, no person
driving a vehicle shall drive to the left thereof, except as
permitted in this section.
(b) When the double parallel lines, one of which is broken, are in
place, no person driving a vehicle shall drive to the left thereof,
except as follows:
(1) That the driver on that side of the roadway in which the
broken line is in place may cross over the double line or drive to
the left thereof when overtaking or passing other vehicles.
(2) As provided in Section 21460.5.
(c) Either of the markings as specified in subdivision (a) or (b)
does not prohibit a driver from crossing the marking when (1) turning
to the left at any intersection or into or out of a driveway or
private road, or (2) making a U-turn under the rules governing that
turn, and either of the markings shall be disregarded when authorized
signs have been erected designating offcenter traffic lanes as
permitted under Section 21657.
(d) Raised pavement markers may be used to simulate painted lines
described in this section when the markers are placed in accordance
with standards established by the Department of Transportation.

I have had two citations that show they do enforce it.

Looking to join a team in the Connecticut area.

tvlodek — Tue, 27 Jun 2006 12:11:00 GMT

Posted by: tvlodek to Teaming:Looking to join a team in the Connecticut area.

I'm looking to join a team in Connecticut/New York/Massachussets area, if you could use any help, e-mail me.

Tom Vlodek

tvlodek.butler@sikorsky.com
tvlodek@yahoo.com

12 and 24Volt Power systems for Military Vehicles

Keenan Campbell — Tue, 27 Jun 2006 04:15:00 GMT

Posted by: Keenan Campbell to Vendor/Suppliers:12 and 24Volt Power systems for Military Vehicles

American Armature Inc. is a defense contractor specializing in mission critical military applications.

We design and built various configurations of alternators, inverters, and related support systems.

http://www.americanarmature.com/Military. htm

We can custom design units that will meet you electrical needs at a very affordable price.

We currently supply products to 4 out of 5 of the top defense contractors in the country.

Feel free to contact me anytime,

Keenan D. Campbell
Program Engineer - Military Applications Worldwide
American Armature, Inc
3750 W River Drive
Davenport, IA 52802
563-323-7994 x101
563-323-8089 Fax
815-252-6383 Direct Line
Keenan@americanarmature.com

Orphans

LeenSTL — Tue, 27 Jun 2006 02:47:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:Orphans

I'm sure that DARPA had a similar reaction which was why they called the CHP and got the interpretation that in the event of a blocked lane etc it is permissible to cross yellow lines.

As I recall, the presenter in the quoted text I attached was Dr Tether. You can find the transcript in the team resources area if you want to peruse it.

Attachments:

quote.txt (327b)

NIWeek Unmanned Systems Summit

Al Wicks (Virginia Tech) — Mon, 26 Jun 2006 04:49:00 GMT

Posted by: Al Wicks (Virginia Tech) to Miscellaneous:NIWeek Unmanned Systems Summit

Each year National Instruments host NIWeek, a conference featuring technologies related to their corporate business plan. This year NI is hosting an Unmanned Systems summit event, a series of papers/presentations relating to unmanned systems. Participants of any of the Grand Challenge events and especially teams that are entering the Urban event are encouraged to submit papers. Sessions currently developed are a session on JAUS, a software architecture for unmanned systems, and a session relating to Challenge X vehicles. Papers should be submitted by 7/15/06
There is limited room for presentations, so if you are interested in exchanging information and ideas for the new Challenge please contact Bruce Billian,

Bruce Billian JOUSTER (434) 766-6791 bbillian@vt.edu
The conference is Aug 8-10 Austin TX, Visit the NI website for complete information on NIWeek06

Al Wicks Team Rocky, Virginia Tech

Orphans

LeenSTL — Sun, 25 Jun 2006 08:22:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:Orphans

According to the California Highway Patrol, it is legal to crosss lines if necessary to avoid an obstacle or blockage etc. This was specificially mentioned in the conference.

Building S. California Team

riversiderobotman — Sat, 24 Jun 2006 05:55:00 GMT

Posted by: riversiderobotman to Teaming:Building S. California Team

Hello,

I'm building a robotics team. I'm looking for the best of the best to -> WIN<- the Darpa Urban Challenge.

Hit me with an email that includes a resume or a summary of your qualifications:

riversiderobotman (at) yahoo (dot) com

Thomas

Orphans

DaveB — Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:16:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Orphans

Also, they shouldn't tie this second lane of a two-lane road into the roads to and from the south, because turning from, or into, a far lane is illegal.

[Edited on 6/23/2006]

Orphans

mjg — Fri, 23 Jun 2006 09:01:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Rules:Orphans

Gulag

As I'm sure you know, our RoutePlanning programs must be able to infer the option to change lanes. This will be useful in two obvious cases (and perhaps other not so obvious ones).
-1- lane change to avoid an obstacle (stationary or moving(car passing))
-2- lane change to effect the most efficent solution in getting from current location to next checkpoint

So the lane isn't really an "orphan". Btw, a comment in the RNDF File indicates it has no exits but is a "passing lane".

Mike Gayle -- Team Base17

Orphans

wolfbob — Fri, 23 Jun 2006 07:12:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Orphans

Not completely true. There are instances where you can make left and right turns from the far lane to the far lane. It is bad stuff to change lanes in an intersection.

As I noted once before in CA it is not legal to cross a double line except for entering or leaving a driveway. This includes passing and obsticles. I hope DARPA notices this strangeness.

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Joaquin — Fri, 23 Jun 2006 05:11:00 GMT

Posted by: Joaquin to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Hi,
We are currently putting together a team in Southern California. If you are interested we would like for you to join our team.
Please email me at jgabriels@avengi.com or go to our website at http://www.avengi.com/
Thanks,
Joaquin Gabriels

Looking for a team - Image Processing

mlinder — Fri, 23 Jun 2006 01:51:00 GMT

Posted by: mlinder to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Bren,
Check out this link: http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/sci/1728 64153.html

You might be interested.

Matt

Orphans

Gulag — Thu, 22 Jun 2006 11:02:00 GMT

Posted by: Gulag to Rules:Orphans

Taking a look at the Bloomington/sample RNDF and MDF, segment 1 has an
orphan lane 1.1. You cannot use A* or D* or a graph planning
algorithm to get there. That's pretty cool barring the fact that DARPA
is going to publish the RNDF 24 hours ahead of time. Even with the
sparsity of the RNDF, it will have the click/point/annotate problem.

[Edited on 6/23/2006]

Attachments:

orphan.jpg (189Kb)

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

jayg — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 11:07:00 GMT

Posted by: jayg to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

BTW, stating that GPS error was THE reason sandstorm went off the road
in the first challenge is a dramatic oversimplification of
reality. It was one of several problems that added up to
failure at that point (perception bug + GPS error + preplanning error +
tracking error all at the same place = robot off road). The
damage repair the week before the race cut short the system testing at
a critical time that could have turned up any of these errors, but the
perception mechanism (sensors and software) was running as well as it
could be tested that day. This is documented exhaustively in
http://www.ri.cmu.edu/pubs/pub_4696.html (see pages 37 and 38
specifically) so no one has to guess or postulate about anything.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

jayg — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 11:06:00 GMT

Posted by: jayg to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DARPA explicitly states that the GPS waypoints may vary wildly from the
actual road to force you to do visual sensing of the road
structure. Their sample RNDF even shows an example where the road
takes a 90 degree turn while the RDNF just cuts off the corner entirely.

This rule almost certainly is speaking to the lane marker type, not the
lane marker position. I think an example of the situation they
are trying to cover is this: The RNDF reports a double yellow
line as the lane marker. In reality, there is a break in the lane
marker for an irrelevant (to the race) intersection. DARPA wants
your vehicle to continue through that break acting as if there was a
double yellow line the whole way even though your sensors may tell you,
"hey, there is no double yellow line there."

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DaveB — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 11:02:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

ptrep, how do you know the vehicle was within 8 cm of where you wanted it for pretty much the entire race?

New FAQ Responses

DaveB — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 10:55:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:New FAQ Responses

The E, in the second part of your first post you say, "My platform is a stock conversion. . ." It seems like the decision might depend on this. If the conversion is performed by a company that produces enough of them to truly call it stock, like, say, the old Shelby Mustangs, then you have a stock vehicle. Otherwise, probably not.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

ptrep — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 10:52:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

I think you would be surprised as to how accurate a good GPS/INS system coupled with a decent control algorithm can be. The vehicle was within about 7-8 cm of where we wanted it to be for pretty much the entire race.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DaveB — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 10:33:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

I think DARPA and most teams fail to understand the challenges of steering this accurately with GPS and INS. The most conservative error numbers provided by manufacturers address accuracy to be expected 95% of the time, or 2 sigma. For the GPS numbers, that's also in good signal conditions. If you don't analyze this like an engineer, it sounds like "almost always", but you need to think in terms of how often the error will be outside that number, how far outside it might be, for how long, and how often that good signal will be unavailable. It's even harder to get a good feel for error buildup in the INS, but you can be sure it won't be good enough to keep a 7 ft wide vehicle between lines 12 feet apart for long.

This error is what ended Sandstorm's run in the first challenge (they had instrumentation to verify location by reference to the real world, but damaged that just before the challenge). The Urban Challenge should have worse GPS reception, among tall buildings, but it might not.

CONCLUSION: use sensors to determine the position of your vehicle, relative to the road, in order to correct GPS/INS position.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

sapper023 — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 09:23:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

I also agree , can someone put together a poll maybe ?
I personally think I can make something do this without GPS if landmarks are visibly available ( not good idea for in a sand storm ) . I think such a system that only uses visual would be rule compliant once it sees a route defined object ( stop sign for example ) .
Parking as " 5 stalls over from the left on row 3 as seen from entrance A " would be nice .
It seems DARPA wants GPS centric solutions and who can blame them as GPS requires less machine intelligence ( presumably more feasible in their eyes I suspect but I doubt the long term flexibility of consequently low intelligence systems ) and there is already an extensive infrastructure supporting GPS .

[Edited on 6/21/2006]

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DividedBy0 — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 07:56:00 GMT

Posted by: DividedBy0 to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

It appears that what jayg and The E are saying is most plausible. DARPA is definitely not giving enough information in the RNDF to reconstruct the road and all its markings exactly, so visual systems will absolutely be necessary.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

The E — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 01:48:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

I had the same impression as jayg . The RNDF file will take precidence if the lane markers vary widely or do not match with the actual road indicators, i.e. road has a single white line and RNDF shows an island separator between lanes. I believe these are acceptable constraints. I don't believe the RNDF is there to steer you off road and have you running in the emergency lane or worse. Visual tracking of the lines should still be used to keep you in bounds when the RNDF and lane markers agree to a margin of error.

New FAQ Responses

The E — Wed, 21 Jun 2006 01:38:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:New FAQ Responses

Actually DaveB, you are probably correct on this. However, this precludes any or most of us from performing any such activies on our challenge cars. Read: production automobiles. If the manufacturer is custom car fabricator I still believe the FAQ rule applies since it is not a factory line product. For new challange vehicles I believe the only exceptions are a car that has been on the road long enough to validate its safety or one that has undergone NHTSA/IIHS approved crash testing.

My conversation with DARPA was far more extensive than simply discussing my stock coversion. I believe there are details I should not post, but if anyone wants my read between the lines interpretation as given to me by an official send me an email ( antispam77.erw at glowriver.com )

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

ptrep — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 10:27:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

If you have an integrated INS/GPS with a good correction service like OmniStar HP, you can get less than 10cm accuracy. So, it is possible.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

www.TeamProdigies.com — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 07:10:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

I agree.. that is strange. If you wanna know what I think there should be no GPS involved in this competition at all, except maybe to give the coordinates of intersections that must be passed through. To have GPS supercede lane markings is simply rediculous.

New FAQ Responses

www.TeamProdigies.com — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 07:05:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Rules:New FAQ Responses

It is my opinion that it should be enough for DARPA if the vehicle is street-legal. If it's able to pass the state patrol tests and get a title, it can't be too bad. I doubt DARPA is going to change the rules on this one though.

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DividedBy0 — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 05:27:00 GMT

Posted by: DividedBy0 to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

Thanks for the response, ptrep.

Looking at the OmniStar datasheets, it appears that really high accuracy can be obtained. And using INS for dead reckoning would account for intermittent GPS. So there goes my first point ;-)

As for the second point - is DARPA expecting us to completely ignore the lane markings on the ground? If the GPS points agree with the lane markings, then ignoring the lane markings and using GPS/INS would be fine. And if the GPS and lane markings disagree, then we are forced to use GPS. It appears to me that the physical lane markings are useless (except maybe for 3 point turns and such).

Thoughts?

Thomas

New FAQ Responses

wolfbob — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 05:22:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:New FAQ Responses

It would seem to me that DARPA's main concern is one of safety. For instance, in the event of a collision and a brake line is severed do you still have the capability to stop (all modern vehicles have dual redundancy in the braking system). If you muck with the fuel lines/tanks etc do you still have the safety inherent in typical motor vehicles to preclude fuel leakage, venting or spilling in any rational situation?

I think that if you do mess with the basic safety features, you must so indicate and show what you have done to preclude any hazard to anyone/anything in any event at least to the extent of damaging other vehicles/property or personnel. I don't think they would care if a simple fender-bender totally destroys YOUR vehicle as long as it doesn't hurt anything else.

Maybe something else to it, but I think this is the issue that brought forth the rule.

WBob.

New FAQ Responses

The E — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 04:16:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:New FAQ Responses

After an exchange of emails with DARPA the verdict is stick with the terms in the FAQ. This overrules the statement of "stock chassis" in the PiP. What they're looking for is a mfg. stock vehicle with minimal modifications to its operating components.

Hope this helps anyone that had plans to do any major mechanical work to their challenge car.

Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

Grasshopper — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 02:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Grasshopper to Teaming:Looking for a Team - Will work Remotely

I received a Computer Engineering BS and an Electronics Engineering BS in 2003. Since then I've been working at Garmin International. www.garmin.com I'm not sure how much in-person time I can provide but I can definititely provide programming and design support. I plan to attend the event next year. Let me know if you're interested and I can answer any questions you may have.
-G-

[Edited on 6/20/2006]

RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

DividedBy0 — Tue, 20 Jun 2006 01:57:00 GMT

Posted by: DividedBy0 to Rules:RNDF Precedence Over Physical Lane Markings?

Hi All!

Just want to see what other people think of this rule in Section 1.7 of the Urban Challenge Rules (June 12):

DARPA’s intent is for the RNDF lane boundary descriptors to match the
physical lane markings on the ground. DARPA cannot ensure that this will be the case in
all areas, and as such the RNDF shall take precedence over the physical ground markings
in conflicting areas.

This rule troubles me for two reasons:

First, the RNDF is keyed to absolute survey (GPS) positions. The accuracy of GPS on the vehicles will vary and will probably never be less than 1 meter. I would think that staying in a narrow corridor defined by absolute GPS points would be practically impossible given meter-accuracy GPS. Even if the points given in the RNDF are 100% accurate, the vehicles will not have the ability to get survey-grade coordinates using differential GPS or WAAS GPS.

Second, what should the vehicle do if the GPS points (actual or measured) intersect a curb? Should the vehicle try to drive the curb to stay within the lines, or should it obey the physical lane markings?

It would seem to me that it would be better to perform fine-tuned lane following using visual systems on the vehicle that do not depend on external signals. What do other people think of this rule?

Thanks!
Thomas

New FAQ Responses

DaveB — Mon, 19 Jun 2006 08:25:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:New FAQ Responses

Rules have evolved during vehicle development for the previous Grand Challenges, and there isn't much the teams can do except change their approach. You describe the modifications to your vehicle as little more that must be done on all entries to make them controllable by computer or microprocessor, but you'll need to give DARPA more detail than you've given here, if you want their blessing (and of course the final blessing doesn't come till your entry is accepted). I'm guessing they won't have any problem with it.

New FAQ Responses

The E — Mon, 19 Jun 2006 03:30:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:New FAQ Responses

A stock chassis encompasses only the structural frame of the vehicle
and makes no mention to the inner workings such as the drive train,
steering, or fuel system.

My platform is a stock conversion to EV. This is certainly a change to
the drive train and consequently to the fuel system as well. It meets
the requirement of a "stock chassis" since the vehicle is based on a
production street legal mid-sized vehicle.

I had always taken the guidelines to mean a vehicle suitable for street
legal use and registrable in the state of California would qualify
under DARPA's guidelines.

I have sent a copy of this as an email to DARPA; not knowing the time
frame for their response I'm hoping to receieve some feedback from
others on this forum.

[Part 2 of 2]

New FAQ Responses

The E — Mon, 19 Jun 2006 03:30:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:New FAQ Responses

I haven't posted until now since my proprosed vehicle platform fell relatively squarly into the guidelines proprosed in the PiP.

However, with the release of the FAQ on 6/15 an new question about vehicle requirements has arisen regarding FAQ #25.

25. Can a vehicle be modified and still be considered a “stock vehicle”?

The suspension, wheels, interior, and shell may be modified without
modifying the status of the vehicle as “stock.” All safety-critical
components must be retained from the original stock vehicle, including
the chassis, steering, fuel system, braking system, and drive train.

This differs from the statement "stock chassis" which is still present
in Urban_Challenge_PIP_Mod04_061506_Redlines .pdf. Where said vehicle
requirements state:

Vehicle must be built upon a full-size stock chassis or a full-size chassis with a

documented safety record. Vehicles smaller than a midsize commercial automobile such

as golf cart-type or all terrain vehicles (ATVs) do not meet this requirement.

[Part 1 of 2]

New FAQ Responses

The E — Mon, 19 Jun 2006 01:28:00 GMT

Posted by: The E to Rules:New FAQ Responses

My opening post was a bit convoluted so I'll summarize by asking:

Is it now against the rules to make modifications to the powertrain
aside from adding actuators and sensors? unless crash
testing or other "documented" means address the safety concern.

My first post indicates I am planning to replace the stock engine with an electric motor. This breaks the term "stock" from the FAQ; would I need a "documented safety record?"

* Free Software *

DaveB — Fri, 16 Jun 2006 09:44:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Technology:*** Free Software ***

If anyone wants a rough check of this viewer, or your own, the attached screen dump shows most of the route segments. It's from a quick import of the sample RNDF into a mapping program, Fugawi, by telling it to use tab delimiters and to ignore the first field. The location is near Falls Church, VA, west of Washington, DC, just east of I-495 (the Beltway).

Though Fugawi's maps are more accurate than most, it's apparent, in this view, that they're a few feet off.

Attachments:

Sample_RNDF_Rev1-2.gif (54Kb)

* Free Software *

mjg — Thu, 15 Jun 2006 10:14:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Technology:*** Free Software ***

*** Free Software ***
I have developed an RNDF Viewer Analyzer
Some Features
-- More than 100 Edits to validate your RNDF file
-- Graphical display of Route Network with 48 levels of Zoom
-- Useful Statistics (distances and counts)
-- Click on the Image (near a wpt) and see Wpt Info (exits, ckpt nbr, street name...)
-- Zoom in far enough and see Traffic flow Arrows and Exit Arrows

Send Comments and Suggestions to the author mjgayle@hughes.net

Michael Gayle -- Team Base17

--. look for future versions on www.base17.com (currently under construction)
-- to download the sampe RNDF file from DARPA, go to http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/rules .asp.

Enjoy!

Attachments:

RNDFViewer.zip (197Kb)

Full Size Vehicle available

JREIndy — Sun, 11 Jun 2006 04:30:00 GMT

Posted by: JREIndy to Teaming:Full Size Vehicle available

Please see the attached document if you are looking for a full size vehicle for the DARPA Urban Challenge. IndyRobotics cannot enter itself but we do have a competitive car available. Please contact me at one of the numbers/sites below. More details in the attachment.

James Eifert
Home/Office: 269-244-5739
Cell: 574-309-8570
james.eifert@gmail.com

Looking for a team - Tampa FL

Paul Ramos — Sun, 11 Jun 2006 02:52:00 GMT

Posted by: Paul Ramos to Teaming:Looking for a team - Tampa FL

Looking to join a team in/around the Tampa Bay area.

Paul Ramos
Paul@applehill.net

ELROB 2006

LeenSTL — Tue, 06 Jun 2006 10:45:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

Some pictures are available on the ELROB site.

Inspiriation

Jake — Tue, 06 Jun 2006 09:14:00 GMT

Posted by: Jake to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

Okay, thanks for everything...

Looking for a team - Image Processing

bworth — Tue, 06 Jun 2006 06:56:00 GMT

Posted by: bworth to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Matt,

I would certainly be interested providing development time for that. An approach could incorporate a hybrid of our auto-tracking and a stereo vision approach to determine direction and range information. This will compensate for the current immaturity of the stereo vision capability. I'll read over your documentation in more detail. If you have any code samples and addition API documentation to use your camera that would be great. You can contact me at: brenworth@vistek.biz.

Bren

Looking for a team - Image Processing

mlinder — Tue, 06 Jun 2006 03:58:00 GMT

Posted by: mlinder to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Bren, Paul,
You may be interested in our VS1501/VS1502 high performance stereo imaging processing hardware platforms. we provide them with the low level software drivers, and you provide the higher level application software. they are small size and low power yet deliver greater performance than a 2.5GHz PC. We also have an IP66 rated stereo pan/tilt unit coming out soon. Visit our website at http://www.valdesystems.com for more information.

Maybe we could provide the hardware,and you Bren could do the software for it.

Matt Linder
Valde Systems, Inc.

Looking for a team - Image Processing

bworth — Mon, 05 Jun 2006 09:47:00 GMT

Posted by: bworth to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Most of the products I'm developing are for use in physical security applications. More recently I've been developing technologies for use in robot applications and include an object auto-tracking technology for pan/tilt mounted cameras, stereo vision disparity mapping, and object type recognition. The auto-tracking is the most mature technology though I need to add ego-motion estimation for use with mobile robots. I envisioned using that technology for modeling the kinematics of the motion fields around the vehicle. However, I have come to learn that there exists some new lidar technology that is capable of performing the same task, more expensive perhaps, but from a risk management standpoint the better option.

From a development standpoint, how are you folks situated? Were you able to get your vehicles automated last year, and what track are you considering persuing?

Thanks,

Bren

Inspiriation

LeenSTL — Sun, 04 Jun 2006 12:28:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

No I don't, but you can join the yahoo group for chibots I think is for Chicago Robotics, or go to www.robomo.com for the St Louis site, either one should be able to help with any questions that you have.

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

ezoltan — Sat, 03 Jun 2006 12:28:00 GMT

Posted by: ezoltan to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

There's no need to get an organized team together. How about just creating some components that would be of use to anyone who is entering the challenge and making those components open source?

For example, DARPA has presented the RNDF and MDF file formats that every contestant must interpret in order to complete the challenge.

http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/docs/ RNDF_MDF_Formats.pdf

How about a Java or C# class library providing a set of objects to represent the RNDF and MDF file contents? This would be a worthy open-source project. Anyone could create further open source projects using it as a basis.

Just a thought.

Erik Zoltan

Inspiriation

Jake — Sat, 03 Jun 2006 11:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Jake to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

Happen to know a good one in Toledo Ohio? I looked on Yahoo & Google, didn't find any. Thanks.

Weight requirement

sapper023 — Sat, 03 Jun 2006 06:33:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Rules:Weight requirement

Buy 1 or 2 working used 1 ton vans preferably with working air conditioning and have a mechanic ready to help you test them before you buy them .
These gas guzzelers are often for sale cheap ( around $ 1K around here no AC ) because of the price of gas being so high shop for vehicals in depressed areas for wonderful deals look for somthing that has a big engine and no trailer hitch that the mechanic thinks will be easy to fix .
I really do not think you will be running up significant miles or wear on these contraptions to be expecting system failures .
Put a rack on each vehical that places your outside intrument packages at a standard hight if the 2 vehicals are not the same and then you will only be having to adjust software or firmware to switch between the 2 vehicals for the handeling characteristics ( accelleration , decelleration , stoping , turning ) .
There is lots of room in a 1 ton van for : a generator and batteries , extra fuel tank , computer racks , garbage can , refrigerator ( for jolt cola chips salsa beans and cheese ) , porta potty , cots .
The worts case you have somthing you can drive to save on hotel bills , best case you have a dog-house your wife can send you to after you win . To save money insure the vehicals as one driver only and not primary transportation ( recreational ) vehicals .

Weight requirement

sapper023 — Sat, 03 Jun 2006 05:55:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Rules:Weight requirement

hmm .... deleting a redundent post does not seem to be an option .

[Edited on 6/5/2006]

Inspiriation

LeenSTL — Fri, 02 Jun 2006 11:04:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

If you're looking for an active robotics club we have www.robomo.com for those in or out of the St Louis area, there are some very knowedgable people in the club who could help answer questions ranging from SW to HW to electronics. Dallas, Seattle, and Chicago all have great clubs, posting to any of those would probably be a good bet.

Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Bob H — Fri, 02 Jun 2006 07:13:00 GMT

Posted by: Bob H to Teaming:Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Thanks Paul.

We have not picked a name yet. Soon maybe. If you know of anyone seeking to work on this GC3, in the Chicago area, please point them to us. I'm sure we'll be in touch over the next 17 months or so...

Bob H.

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 12:40:00 GMT

Posted by: Joaquin to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Hi Paul,

Currently our team is called AV Engineers.

-Joaquin Gabriels

Preliminary rules = CDL

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 12:15:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

Sparky,

We have a new fundraising program in operation that is already showing much better results than what we used for the last two races. The website is being handled by volunteers. A major revision is in the works.

The eight wheel drive TATRA - All Terrain Truck - ours is turquoise - was on display out front of the hotel where the DARPA Conference was held and was sporting it's six new radars. It was pictured on our easle display along with what it looks like when pulling a A1M2 Abrams tank on a low-boy through sand. Great picture. You wouldn't believe all the cool featurse this truck has. 520 horse power, air cooled multi-fuel diesel, suitable for desert racing. (Frequently wins the DAKAR) Named after the impossibly difficult TATRA mountain range.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 6/1/2006]

Attachments:

Weight requirement

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:47:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Weight requirement

Kevin,

Can you help me automate the 30,000 lb TATRA - All Terrain Truck that my sponsor has provided to my team?

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:42:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Kevin,

You do not have to do everything yourself. If you have something significant to contribute to the effeort, join a team that has the resources to do the things you cant and contribute what you can. That way no one with a good idea is being stopped, they just have to play well with others. If you have good ideas join my team.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Inspiriation

Jake — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 11:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Jake to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

Neat, very neat. Do you have some way I can contact you and have more of a 'live' conversation like AIM or Yahoo?

Inspiriation

LeenSTL — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 03:31:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

I've been working lately on a RoboMagellan bot which will have an embedded PC running Fedora Core 5, programmed in C++, any microcontrollers would probably be done in C or C++. It will follow GPS waypoints similar to a Grand Challenge vehicle. There are several types of RoboMagellan competitions being done around the country, of course they don't pay big bucks or anything.

For my teams 2005 GC vehicle, I did the code above the microcontroller level in C++ on Fedora Core 3. We had several microcontrollers which were programmed by other team members in C. Data collected from the microcontrollers and other input devices was collected and interpreted by my code.

While at the 2005 Grand Challenge I asked many of the teams about their choices of languages and OS platforms. I teach both C++ & Linux so I was pleased to see lots of those, and of course many teams also used C, C#, with OS choices mostly ranging from Linux to Mac (aka freeBSD) with a few Windows based systems. Some teams found that their vision drivers required Windows so they would use that for a vision server and Linux elsewhere.

One of the more impressive programming efforts was done by Team DAD which had all programming done in TI DSP assembler, no PC required!

[Edited on 6/1/2006]

Inspiriation

Jake — Thu, 01 Jun 2006 01:34:00 GMT

Posted by: Jake to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

Yup, I've already watched Nova's "Great Race" it was amazing, thats how I got so inspiried. Do you do any programing or stuff along the lines of Robotics?

How to do the Urban Challenge

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 11:52:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

John,

I agree. The changes that have been happening are significant and rapid. Our newest GPS antenna is about the size of my thumb - compared to the mixing bowl size from back when we started all of this. The cost is also a fraction of what it was then and capability is way up.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Inspiriation

LeenSTL — Wed, 31 May 2006 11:30:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

Jake, why not try to find a local robotics club? Depending on the size of your city there might be an active group, of course you can always join a Yahoo group for robotics clubs such as the Chicago group etc. They should be able to help answer questions.

You might find some inspring stuff in an interview on the PBS Nova "Great Race" website, there is a great interview with the principal SW guy for Team Gray whose vehicle finished fourth in the 2005 GC.

Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 11:27:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Welcome aboard, It is great to have another team near by.
Are you calling your team the Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team? or are you going to go by a different name?
We have some team members in the Chicago area, perhaps they can help your team?

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 5/31/2006]

Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 11:22:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Jon,

Have you hooked up with our other team members in Phoenix yet?

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 11:17:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Sparky,

Which claims are you talking about?

That I worked for Ford Motor Company? Stop by my shop here in TC and I will be glad to show you my Ford Motor Company Executive ID card. They let me keep it as a souvineer when they disolved the steamship division.

Don't you remember? As many of the readers of this Forum may recall, when it became apparent that we had not raised enough money to finish our cars and transport them the 5,500 mile round trip to be in the 2005 race, I offered my teams services to the other teams. We farmed out team members to join other teams, sent parts, business contacts, etc. We shared whatever we had with the teams that signed up for it. Team members who remained here provided technical support to other teams. We provided advice on strategy, design, etc. Much of it was used in the 2005 race by the teams who had asked for it.

Yes, I think it is very important that people be aware of what they are getting into. Joining my team means that they will be working to make sure that the US Army gets the guidance system it needs as soon as possible - even if that means helping other teams. I don't think it would be fair to the Gold Star mothers to do it any other way. The quidance system we are working on does not belong to us, it belongs to the drivers who have been killed while waiting for it to be fielded.

Paul F. Grayson

Looking for a team - Image Processing

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 10:46:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Bren,

I would like to have you on my team and would like to know more about the products you have to offer.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get two today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Looking to join team in the bay area

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 10:39:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking to join team in the bay area

Ofer,

I would be glad to have you on my team if you would be interested in working by computer.

Working on my team has the added advantage that one of our sponsors wants us to design the commercial version for them to market. A volunteer job now could turn into a paid job, if you would like to do more than just the race.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Looking to form a team in Philadelphia PA area

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 10:34:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking to form a team in Philadelphia PA area

Phil,

I would be glad to have you on my team if you are interested in working by computer.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Wed, 31 May 2006 10:17:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin,

What do you call your team?

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
#03 AV WENDY DARLING
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4-Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187 ; (231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 12/31/2006]

Inspiriation

Jake — Wed, 31 May 2006 08:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Jake to Miscellaneous:Inspiriation

First time I heard about DARPA was on PBS's Nova. It was amazing! I'm a programmer and web developer and just watching that Nova inspired me to do so much more. I've always been interested in Robotics and now I have been studing and learning more than ever. If anyone has any tips or someone I can ask questions to, please email me at Jake@PolarNex.Net.

ELROB 2006

sapper023 — Tue, 30 May 2006 10:21:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

scheduled 15th-19th of May 2006
this was from the web site you indicated
I found no results from the website although there is an indication that there will be results posted later
related websites of the participants
can be found here
http://www.fgan.de/~elrob2006/rcv_appl.ht ml
The "SCORPION" is a bit like some of the technology I developed and used on my own a long time ago for any number of legs , it is nice to see others are starting to catch up to me .

[Edited on 5/30/2006]

Serious Competition?

sapper023 — Tue, 30 May 2006 10:01:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Teaming:Serious Competition?

I knew some people from Lockheed Martin in the town I grew up in
, I hope they got some of the smart ones I met on their team with free rein .

[Edited on 6/5/2006]

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson Bridwell — Tue, 30 May 2006 04:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Kevin:

I think that we all sympathize and understand your viewpoint.

However, although we all have a general idea what DARPA needs, none of us are in a position to dictate their detailed requirements.

And yes, although it is often quite superficial, good press is vital in any democracy. It was important in WWII, as General Patton discovered, and it is even more so today, where military operations are run in the context of daily popularity polls.

It is my personal belief that the 2004 DGC was almost killed off by that video clip of GhostRider falling over at the starting gate. That was what everyone remembered, and when DARPA goes before congress to request funding, impressions count.

Nelson

Serious Competition?

Nelson Bridwell — Tue, 30 May 2006 03:14:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Teaming:Serious Competition?

Looking over the attendees at the participants conference list...
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/docs/ UC_Participants_Conference_Attendees.pdf
...besides many past participants, I notice a number of defense contractors and even a few automakers. I have a hunch that there might be some rather serious contenders this year (that in comparision could make previous events look like the Red Bull Flugtag!)

Auto:
1 from Daimler Chrysler
1 from Ford

Defense:
5 from Lockheed Martin
2 from Boeing
1 from Northrup Grumman
1 from Honeywell
1 from BAE Systems (UK)

Misc:
4 from iRobot

[Edited on 5/30/2006]

Weight requirement

Media Dude — Tue, 30 May 2006 03:09:00 GMT

Posted by: Media Dude to Rules:Weight requirement

If life or fortune is being risked on an '85 Tahoe, you probably wouldn't have made it far anyway. The cost of the vehicle isn't half the problem the sensors will pose when cutting the check.

In the last GC, a custom vehicle could really make a difference through size or mobility. In an urban environment, building your own vehicle sounds like a waste of resources.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Sparky — Mon, 29 May 2006 12:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

The whole drive-by-wire thing is trivial. You missed my point. What I said was don't double your work. A small ATV will take a different actuation system(physically) then a car. No need to get personal. Again, if you don't like the rules, don't participate. Have your own contest if you want.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Kevin — Mon, 29 May 2006 10:47:00 GMT

Posted by: Kevin to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

If you think actuation of a control surface is a major problem in this competition, you don't understand the real problems. Actuation is trivial.
After the decision is made to stop, the type of vehicle to stop is a minor change. As I'm sure you've been told over and over, "Size doesn't matter".

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Sparky — Sun, 28 May 2006 10:40:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

To Kevin and those like him:

The competition is what it is. If you don't like it, don't participate. Review your physics. What vehicles on the road don't weigh at least one ton. This is the easy part. Convert your daily driver, or buy something else. All testing up to the site visit can occur with you sitting in the driver's seat. Finding a place to practice will always be an issue, but this is part of the competition. It isn't just about getting a technically viable vehicle, it's about what it takes to get to that point. And, unfortunately for those of us who are more technically minded, this means marketing and people skills. Start beating the bushes and making phone calls. You're bound to know someone, who knows someone, that can help. I would not recommend starting on a toy, then installing the systems on a full size vehicle. If you are truly working out of your garage, this will kill the project. You would have to do twice as much installation work, and vehicle dynamics are going to be different. Not to mention that you would more than likely need to use vastly different drive-by-wire actuation components.

The important thing about the rules is that they don't change drastically. The vehicle requirements should be stated up front, and held to.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Kevin — Sun, 28 May 2006 10:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Kevin to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Mr. Bridwell (and DARPA)
The expression of disappointment at arbitrary conditions which bars someone from a competition that could lead to his being able to make a true contributions to the country, and to the men who serve this country, have a slightly higher priority than good press. The original purpose of this competition, as I understood it, was to allow anyone with interest to try and solve problems that are now causing the loss of life to our service people overseas. This competition drew from a greater population than the "simple" competitions you advise as an alternative. To win at an SAE sponsored local event wouldn't lead to acceptance and action on the part of any governmental agency. It is an important competition; the heart of which is the creation of systems that can perceive real situations and take appropriate action based on that reality. When a motorcycle crashes within 5 yards of the start, although laughable for some, the lessons learned maybe the ones needed to accomplish the mission. The government has other means for getting "the big boys", large universities and businesses, involved. They don't need this competition as well. For Edison working in his garage, buying and running a one ton monster around the streets is not a possibility.

[Edited on 5/28/2006]

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

arturomdn — Sun, 28 May 2006 09:54:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

My interpretation of what was said is that the potential for potholes
should not dictate your choice of vehicles. There might be some
dirt roads, so road detection/road following needs to be flexible, not
just follow the curb or follow the yellow/white line, and there might
be a pothole here or there. The point of the challenge is not
off-road capability, the point of the challenge is not waypoint
following, it is traffic. For what it's worth, I believe Stanford
is using a VW Passat http://www.vw.com/passat/

Weight requirement

Kevin — Sun, 28 May 2006 09:46:00 GMT

Posted by: Kevin to Rules:Weight requirement

I know you've heard this before but size doesn't matter. The winners of the last contest were full size vehicles when the condition was not mandatory. For those that have the resources or are taking Track A that's great.
Actuating controls is a trivial task compared to analyzing the conditions and calculating the required movement. Unless you think that a small vehicle has an advantage because it can move more between the lines without going out of the lane, I fail to see your point. Quite frankly if DARPA wants to limit it's contestants to schools and businesses, I'll just use my time somewhere else. With 25 years of programming experience and 10 years of control system and instrumentation development, I'm sure I can find something to do, for which I don't have to risk my life or fortune.

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

DaveB — Sun, 28 May 2006 09:08:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

Not only do I think a Geo Metro could have finished the two off-road challenges, but I doubt it would even have been a disadvantage, but some of those who've actually traveled those courses might disagree. In addition, I'd bet the potholes in the next Challenge will be no worse than those around NYC, not that I'd want to drive into some of those. If a 4x4 was needed for this sort of driving, we’d all be driving them, and you aren't going to find out what obstacles the Challenge course will hold until that day comes, and I'll bet no one at DARPA will know until shortly before that day.

Any useful autonomous vehicle of the future will need to detect potholes and other pitfalls, so DARPA would probably much rather you provided a Geo with hole detection features than try to drive over them with a 6x6, or such. In fact, it might increase your chance of selection if you provided a hole or two in your on-site inspection course.

By the way, are you sure that Geo meets the as-delivered weight and size requirements? Hmmm, the specs for a '97 Metro make it look a bit light, but plenty long. Maybe you could find one with some heavy accessories. Then again a Prizm is plenty heavy, and a Tracker adds 4-wheel-drive to half-again more weight than required.

[Edited on 5/28/2006]

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

Mark — Sun, 28 May 2006 09:05:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

Darn, you're right! Darpa says it has to weigh under 2K lbs UNLADEN.

I was assuming the Geo Metro was 1900 lbs, and I would have at least 100 lbs of robotic equipment on it.

I wonder if DARPA realizes there are actually still some automobiles
out there that are under 2K lbs. I think they didn't know that
(as I didn't) and thought that 2000 lbs was a safe cutoff that would
seperate the automobiles from the golf carts.

If anyone's interested, try to ask DARPA if they'll allow a 90's Geo Metro

Weight requirement

DaveB — Sun, 28 May 2006 08:35:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Weight requirement

Well, it's a lot easier to keep a quad between the lines than a full-size vehicle. Also techniques you use to actuate vehicle controls are more likely to be universally useful if you're adapting a standard car. It's unfortunate if you have a place you could test that ATV and not an automobile, but maybe you could do development on that course, then move up to something like an '87 Chevy (or Jeep). When the time comes to test the full size version, you can surely find a country road or unused parking lot, but for the site visit it might improve your chances if you rent a lot somewhere, and lay down some lanes with white and yellow tape.

VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

Mark — Sun, 28 May 2006 03:04:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark to Miscellaneous:VIRGINIA CONFERENCE

DARPA website makes it clear that the next challenge is not about
'offroading'. Yet there will be unpaved roads and potholes.

So are they hinting that I should still probably use a truck?
Because I sure would like to use a Geo Metro, if they aren't going to
hold it against me.

A Geo Metro will handle any rural unpaved road just fine, but I'm
wondering if the potholes will be radical enough that the vehicle could
get stuck in them.

Or maybe the 'potholes' will be so extremely radical that both the
GeoMetro AND a truck would both get stuck in the pothole, thus the
necessity of visually detecting them.

Maybe 'pothole' simply means the NYC potholes that I'm familiar with,
where it will cause a massive jolt to the vehicle, but will not cause
the vehicle to get stuck.

I really don't know. If anyone has any hints, let me know,
because it actually does have a pretty massive impact on vehicle choice.

Is anyone else planning to use an ordinary 2WD automobile?

Weight requirement

www.TeamProdigies.com — Sun, 28 May 2006 02:55:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Rules:Weight requirement

Agreed.

Weight requirement

Kevin — Sat, 27 May 2006 09:39:00 GMT

Posted by: Kevin to Rules:Weight requirement

I believe the weight and size requirement for the contest will eliminate anyone not connected with a company or university. Where can you test a one-ton vehicle? Control, instrumentation and detection systems don't rely on size or weight. A four wheeled cycle with the necessary systems should be able to compete. If the final mission includes the ability to transport items larger than the test vehicle is capable of carrying then the systems could be scaled up or move altogether. Requirements which eliminate a large proportion of those who competed last time, should be considered carefully. There are some of us out here in the cold who believe we have something to offer.

"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

arturomdn — Fri, 26 May 2006 11:46:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Rules:"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

For some reason there was an extra space in the URL,
clicking here should work

Greater Autonomy

sapper023 — Fri, 26 May 2006 10:48:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Rules:Greater Autonomy

I recommend defensive driving and countermeasures for such assault as this will be needed anyways .
An ounce of prevention ( has anyone calculated how much user pressure on keyboard mouse VR headset is needed total for programming such an endeavor , let alone moving around all that hardware ) is often cheaper than a pound ( or several pounds for a replacement bumper ) of cure .
How about reinforced resilient wrap around bumper ?
Please make sure you shock mount you hardware at least .

"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

sapper023 — Fri, 26 May 2006 10:16:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Rules:"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

yes now that following post does now work or you could edit the first post with some of the the same post .
That could also be a inefective parking problem solution . )

[Edited on 5/27/2006]

"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

LeenSTL — Fri, 26 May 2006 02:21:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

Thanks for cleaning up the stealth space, for some reason there's an extra space that only shows up in the final page. It didn't show in the submission text or even when it's edited ... !!??

"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

LeenSTL — Thu, 25 May 2006 11:20:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:"Tracked vehicles not allowed" rule

Maybe something like this is why they want to avoid large tracked vehicles: http://www.cybersalt.org/cleanlaugh/image s/03/jeepflat.htm

[Edited on 5/26/2006]

Greater Autonomy

DaveB — Thu, 25 May 2006 07:39:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Greater Autonomy

Well, you can bet DARPA will weed out any car that shows aggresive behivior before the Urban Challenge. Of course some team could secretly change its software, but why should they. Too risky, both mechanically and from a standpoint of disqualification by a DARPA observer. Put your time and money into software, sensors, and actuators.

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin — Thu, 25 May 2006 02:08:00 GMT

Posted by: Joaquin to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Hi Charles,
I am personally located in Irvine, but the team in general is currently located in the LA and Orange County area. I personally competed last year with team AVS, but because as far as I know they are not competing this year I had decided to start up a new team. Currently there are 5 of us on the team with 3 potential members. We are currently composed of UCI engineers, car buffs, industry engineers, and are currently looking for new members. If you would like to learn more about us or meet us, please email me at jgabriels@avengi.com. Also we will be having our first general team meeting this saturday(May 27) at 10AM in Duarte. Please email me if you would like to attend.

Joaquin Gabriels

EMC

ptrep — Wed, 24 May 2006 10:52:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Miscellaneous:EMC

We were crazy enough to take a soccer-mom SUV and send it into the desert. Why not send it into the environment it was designed for? That being said, we are open to ideas. Anyone looking to donate a vehicle (or two or three)?

Paul
Team Gray

EMC

ptrep — Wed, 24 May 2006 10:48:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Miscellaneous:EMC

We were able to interface to steering/transmission/gas/throttle/brake/ turn signals/etc through voltage wires. There was no API to speak of. If we wanted to switch to Drive from Park, we would ground the Drive wire momentarily. Gas and steering were done by varying the voltage from ~.5 to ~4.5 volts.

All and all, it was easy to work with and was very reliable.

Paul
Team Gray

Greater Autonomy

mjg — Wed, 24 May 2006 04:23:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Rules:Greater Autonomy

It seemed unfair to me as well till i talked to some friends who follow car racing. Apparently there is precedent. If another racer takes out your car and it can't be repaired (eg. Indy 500) you're out of luck. Two solutions come to mind (software -- defensive driving logic, hardware -- reinforced vehicle). Let's hope it doesn't turn into the DARPA Demolition Derby ;-)

EMC

Patriot Robots — Wed, 24 May 2006 01:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Patriot Robots to Miscellaneous:EMC

What was the interface mechanism? Did you have an API?

--Ray

EMC

LeenSTL — Tue, 23 May 2006 10:17:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:EMC

Congrats on a great run in GC2005, I thought it was awesome seeing Kat-5's Saturday evening finish at Primm; the whole tent was cheering whenever some video showed the bot going thru Beer Bottle Pass. The Nova interview at the Great Race site is good also, too bad they didn't get more of your team & vehicle into the video.

Did you get the whole ball of wax from EMC, ie, transmission along with gas/steering/brakes? If so that puts you in good shape for UC. What is your teams' thinking on your hybrid Escape as a suitable UC vehicle?

EMC

ptrep — Tue, 23 May 2006 09:06:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Miscellaneous:EMC

We (Team Gray) used EMC drive-by-wire from EMC for KAT-5. It was probably the most reliable piece of hardware on the entire vehicle. Well worth the money in my opinion.

Paul
Team Gray

Greater Autonomy

Alen — Tue, 23 May 2006 09:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Alen to Rules:Greater Autonomy

Somewhere in the slides it states that the vehicle responsible for the collision is deemed disqualified. Time is provided for minor repairs of the victim vehicle and it can be re-run.

Webcast Video/Slides

Alen — Tue, 23 May 2006 08:58:00 GMT

Posted by: Alen to Miscellaneous:Webcast Video/Slides

I managed to find all the slides in my Cache as I watched the broadcast. Nevertheless it's great that they posted them.

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Charles Nguyen — Tue, 23 May 2006 08:48:00 GMT

Posted by: Charles Nguyen to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Hi Joaquin,

Can you tell me briefly about yourself? I'm in Newport Coast.

RNDF and MDF?

DaveB — Tue, 23 May 2006 08:42:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

I agree with LeenSTL that a major reason the second Challenge was successful was the lengthy testing cycle, but I think DARPA deserves a lot of the credit for this. The schedule for that Challenge FORCED the teams to have working vehicles long before the NQE, giving them plenty of time to work out the bugs. The Urban Challenge is similar. You'll have to have something working by April 13, 2007, for the video, in order to get selected, and it better be working WELL by June 11, or you'll never get past the site visit. That gives you four and a half months to get it working RIGHT.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

DaveB — Tue, 23 May 2006 07:52:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

I doubt teams will be allowed near the course before the start. I've finally figured out a way to parse that sentence in Rules section 3.5, "Team activities to discover or exploit information about the course that is not openly available by pre-running or any other means may result in disqualification." so it means what I think they meant. Just add commas, "Team activities to discover or exploit information about the course that is not openly available, by pre-running or any other means, may result in disqualification." The original wording implies you CAN do pre-running, but that's probably not what they meant. Of course you could probably get away with working from existing aerial photos, etc, but it seems even THAT would be cheating, and as they said in the conference, that's not the challenge. The challenge will be the behavior with moving vehicles and other obstacles.

Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

LeenSTL — Tue, 23 May 2006 02:36:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

EMC did steering, throttle, brakes, and transmission for some teams in the GC 2005, I think they were charging about $30K, plus you had to get the vehicle to / from Louisiana. Apparently they did a good job on the Kat-5 vehicle!

For Roboteq's view of motor control in a full size vehicle go to roboteq.com and scan for something like "Controlling a full size vehicle", there was a motorhead show a few years back which made a giant RC vehicle using Roboteq gear. The ideas are the same for actuating the steering etc on a robot, of course instead of the Roboteq controller reacting to joystick signals you'd configure it to read serial commands from a PC or microcontroller. They work great, several teams used them in the GC vehicles.

Just out of curiosity, why do you ask about the horn? Since that is controlled by a relay, isn't a horn EZ to take over via a microcontroller?

[Edited on 5/23/2006]

Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

Mark Fiala — Tue, 23 May 2006 01:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark Fiala to Miscellaneous:Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

The vehicle conversion company I saw is in the "Vendor/suppliers" topic under the post "VIDEOptions".

Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

Mark Fiala — Tue, 23 May 2006 01:34:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark Fiala to Miscellaneous:Kits for converting vehicles to computer control

Hello,

Does anyone have any good suggestions for where to get modules to install into a vehicle so that it can be controlled by computer? Gas, brakes, lights, horn, etc.

Ideally a kit that a mechanic can install. I assume some may exist for specific vehicles.

Another important feature would be one that can be easily turned on and off so that the vehicle could be controlled again by a human operator.

Perhaps something exists for quadrapelic drivers? (if they're allowed to drive at all anywhere).

Also, could someone post a description of how the control is typically done? I would guess that some cylinders could be added to the power steering, rather than some large contraption actually turning the steering wheel. The gas pedal could be controlled with some modification to the cruise control mechanism. Just some guesses from a non-mechanic person.

Apologies if this is quite a "newbie" question, I've trolled a little bit on this site and only found one company offering conversion of vehicles.
Mark

VIDEOption

Mark Fiala — Tue, 23 May 2006 01:20:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark Fiala to Vendor/Suppliers:VIDEOption

Hello, I just sent a private message but then figured others might want to see this conversation in case they were interested in your services.

Can you give estimates of prices to get a vehicle converted to automatic control? Likely this is only possible for vehicle models that you have experience with.

This would lead to the question of what vehicles you suggest, ones that are more amenable to adding controls.

Also, with your modifications, is it possible to have a simple way to deactivate the computer control so that the vehicle can be driven normally again?

Finally, any possibilities to buy subsystems from you, for teams like mine with a low budget?

Thanks,
Mark

Looking to form a team in Philadelphia PA area

Phil — Tue, 23 May 2006 01:18:00 GMT

Posted by: Phil to Teaming:Looking to form a team in Philadelphia PA area

I am looking to form a team in the Philadelphia area. If you are interested in joining a team or have already started a team in the Philadelpia area please contact me at prush@comcast.net .

Thanks.

Cash Prizes for Track B ?

mjg — Mon, 22 May 2006 12:48:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Miscellaneous:Cash Prizes for Track B ?

That suggestion (contacting US Representatives) was addressed as a question to Dr Tether -- his reply, as i remember it, was "Do what you gotta do". One has to believe that when the House and Senate meet in conference on this Bill they will agree to change the wording to include DARPA.

Should that fail -- an obvious alternative, to preserve the TrackB prizes, is simply to move the NQE and UFE up 5wks, placing both within the control of existing legislation. The drawback of course being less time to prepare :-(

Cash Prizes for Track B ?

Igor — Mon, 22 May 2006 11:10:00 GMT

Posted by: Igor to Miscellaneous:Cash Prizes for Track B ?

Hello Everybody,

I could not attend the meeting in D.C. but watched the webcast. It looks like DARPA maybe in a position where it cannot award cash prizes only trophies :-). Has anyone talked to the DARPA folks and figured out if there was a need for us to be speaking to our congress reps on this issue or do they think it can be resolved before, say, July 4th ?

Igor.
http://pegasusbridge.blogspot.com
http://www.pegasus-bridge.com

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Mon, 22 May 2006 11:07:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

Bob H, I think that Car TV mentions that Dexter was doing very well, actually winning up to the point where they went out, in their piece on the GC event. The Nova piece focuses on Team Dad among others, they are the ones that lost their innovative spinning laser array. They have all-around coverage with that unit, perfect for the UC!

There were many good teams that on another day might have won. Clearly the thing that set the better teams apart was the massive amount of testing they did. Take a look at any of the better teams and you'll find that they didn't just start testing right before the NQE, they spent much of the summer or even longer working out the kinks. That is probably one of the reasons why the Gray Team was so good, they actually rented a quarry, built their own test course and drove in it right from the beginning.

As far as the Red Team's performance in the GC 2005, if they had reversed the performance profiles for the vehicles and made Sandstorm the more aggressive of the two then they probably would have taken first and fourth places, possibly letting Kat-5 finish ahead of H1ghlander. I'm sure if they had any inkling of the loss of power problems in H1ghlander they would have done something different.

RNDF and MDF?

sapper023 — Mon, 22 May 2006 10:47:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

While delighted with the successes of sincere competitors who did do a noble effort I was troubled by those who did do things like fly overs and other prior mapping methods as the latter were polluting good science with going for the money halfway measures that did not result in substantive technological innovation . While fly overs or some sort of mapping and use of emissive devices may be helpful in research dependence on such would be shameful to present as anything other than a intermediate stop gap measure for controlled applications .
The best solutions will be without dependence on emissive devices and capable of operation where needed even if it is on mars for example or with some wrong information .
Those are good people who did the good work of making flexible systems capable of going from point A to point B well .
It is clear to me that there are still people trying to just go for the money and not just make something that can work despite any rule changes that may come .
My condolences to those sincere individuals who found themselves in teams which had members of no scientific integrity in control .
It is my hope that DARPA holds a hard line of rules that will prevent a non usefull result for they seem to be asking for something that will be useful and we all have learned from the past what should be asked for .

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson Bridwell — Mon, 22 May 2006 10:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

WB:

Try looking here: http://www.fbo.gov/spg/ODA/DARPA/CMO/BAA0 6-36/Attachments.html

Nelson

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson Bridwell — Mon, 22 May 2006 09:41:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

"Vehicle must be capable of loading a mission description file via a standard USB 2.0 flash drive." "The vehicle will have 5 minutes to process a mission description before attempting the course."

Actually, at the participants conference they indicated that the RNDF (Route Network Definition File) will be available at least 24 hours in advance of the start, so it is possible that some teams will conduct a marathon human inspection of the route in order to identify potential static risks.

[Edited on 5/22/2006]

Webcast Video/Slides

DaveB — Mon, 22 May 2006 09:08:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:Webcast Video/Slides

This question was asked at the conference, and DARPA promised the slides and transcript would be published, but they weren't sure about the video. They don't seem to be posted yet--probably looking for a good way to publish the video.

AHA! The slides are STILL THERE. Just follow the links from the Urban Challenge home page. Of course you'll need Java script enabled. If you watched it live, it comes up at the END of the slide show (stores your location w/a cookie).

[Edited on 5/22/2006]

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

arturomdn — Mon, 22 May 2006 07:24:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

ACfishing — Mon, 22 May 2006 07:02:00 GMT

Posted by: ACfishing to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

So will this mean that homemade vehicles aren't allowed??!!!?

Taxicab Algorithm

Nibor — Mon, 22 May 2006 05:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Miscellaneous:Taxicab Algorithm

Wolfbob, the short version is probing and inching in until max cabs in min space. Interesting math exercise but doesn't go anywhere in NY either.

I can see this with a bot starting into a turn and then breaking, paused, or just becoming senile resulting in a pileup. A real good one would be a string of bots starting up a blocked lane. My vivid imagination sees the advantage of a 30,000 lb monster truck. Wonder if driving around on top of bots counts as a collision?

Webcast Video/Slides

Nibor — Mon, 22 May 2006 04:50:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Miscellaneous:Webcast Video/Slides

Alen, slides are out under team resources.

Taxicab Algorithm

wolfbob — Mon, 22 May 2006 04:39:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Miscellaneous:Taxicab Algorithm

I know of the Taxicab number and the Taxicab distance or metric, but never heard of the Taxicab Algorithm. Did they elaborate at the conference??

WBob

RNDF and MDF?

Bob H — Sun, 21 May 2006 11:22:00 GMT

Posted by: Bob H to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

It seems as if a lot of effort is going in to make sure that the RED Teams approach to this race is not repeated, but I have not seen anyone actually mention their name. Am I missing some good info? Clearly, Red's 2 Teams used every legal angle available to them including gaming the system, which is probably what this is all about. DARPA is clearly putting its experience to work on GC3, and specifying more clearly what it wants to see. I don't see enough people giving credit to the 3 to 5 teams that did not finish last year, but were VERY close if not for...flat tire, loose strap, etc.. and I just read (on the Red Team's web site) that one of Red Teams trucks finished within 2 minutes of the time it was told to. So that if Red W. had said finish in 5 hours, the thing might have done just that.

USB 2.0 Flash Drive

DaveB — Sun, 21 May 2006 09:58:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:USB 2.0 Flash Drive

Centrex, I don't know, but I'll bet a cookie the flash drive will be returned to DARPA before the start, so they can load the next mission while the vehicle does its thing. Even if you could keep it, I recommend you put it onto your own hard or flash drive, because you don't know how fast DARPA's memory will be. USB 2.0 can be VERY fast (it think my 2 gig drive is faster than my hard drive, but haven't tested it), but if you have slow flash memory, it's a moot point. If you read the specs, the speeds are orders of magnitude different.

Greater Autonomy

DaveB — Sun, 21 May 2006 09:49:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Greater Autonomy

wolfbob, you say, "you are also given a number of missions", and "Once you have completed a mission. . .". I don't believe you get the 2nd mission till you complete the 1st, and so on, nor to I think you start the 2nd mission at a different location, and I'm certain the time in the pits counts against your Challenge time.

There ARE up to 20 vehicles flailing around the circuit at the same time, plus DARPA said they'll add some of their own, and not only do you lose if some jerk takes you out, but you can't use the backup car you may have brought along, but you CAN use it to switch before the final event as long as it uses the same software, and you CAN canabalize it for parts. DARPA made it clear, in their talk, that there will be one very busy intersection, as LeenSTL described.

They said the conference materials will be available online, hopefully including the video we watched live.

Webcast Video/Slides

Alen — Sun, 21 May 2006 08:04:00 GMT

Posted by: Alen to Miscellaneous:Webcast Video/Slides

Hi All,

Does anyone know if the slides/video of the participants conference are available post webcast?

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Sun, 21 May 2006 04:07:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

Another effect of using an undisclosed location is the inability of deep-pocket teams to get satellite or lidar fly-overs and cartography drive-overs as was done in GC 2004 & 2005.

RNDF and MDF?

arturomdn — Sun, 21 May 2006 01:25:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

I think what LeenSTL is referring to was a comment by DARPA that the
roads that will be used for the event are probably not to be found in
an existing public GIS database. However, they went on to say
that they will release an aerial picture of the area, and release a
version of the RNDF in advance because this event is not "about the
waypoints" it is about traffic interaction and avoiding
collisions. We can study the RNDF all we want, what matters is
detecting and detail tracking of vehicles, especially at intersections
to determine right of way. They said the site visit will be very,
very tough, as will the NQE where the vehicle might be tested merging
into traffic twenty times. Dangerous behavior will not be
tolerated. Overly cautious behavior will not be tolerated.
Basically, the robot should assess situations and react in a timely
manner, should merge into traffic and "tuck in" while keeping a prudent
but not excessive distance (8 meters). That is my understanding,
correct me if I'm wrong.

RNDF and MDF?

wolfbob — Sat, 20 May 2006 11:00:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

USB 2.0 Flash Drive

Centrex — Sat, 20 May 2006 09:43:00 GMT

Posted by: Centrex to Miscellaneous:USB 2.0 Flash Drive

I haven't seen much information about the standard USB 2.0 flash drive in the provided documentation from DARPA.

Does anyone know if the flash drive will be removed once the MDF and RNDF have been loaded at the beginning of each mission (at the start chute), or if it will remain connected throughout the mission, or the entire challenge.

Greater Autonomy

LeenSTL — Sat, 20 May 2006 02:59:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:Greater Autonomy

At the conference the idea was given that the sample file size times a small number would be about the size of the eventual RNDF. Picture four of the areas defined in the sample file, each radiating out from a central traffic circle, this might be something like the eventual RNDF. Since all bots would be active on similar but different missions, there would be a constant flow of bot traffic through the traffic circle, at intersections, etc, plus there would be some additonal human traffic interjected by DARPA, along with blockages which could come and go.

The more I hear, the more I think this should be called the Grander Challenge!

Looking to join team in the bay area

LeenSTL — Sat, 20 May 2006 02:53:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Teaming:Looking to join team in the bay area

There were quite a few teams last year from California. Stanford was at the conference (which might not help you), and I'm sure there will be more teams being announced soon. Check the GC2005 archives for other CA teams and check here, or you might want to start a team yourself.

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Sat, 20 May 2006 02:49:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

The event will be held in a non-public area.

RNDF and MDF?

DaveB — Fri, 19 May 2006 08:18:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL, the draft rules are now posted, and Section 6.4.1 includes, "The UFE RNDF will be provided to teams at least 24 hours in advance of the start." Conclusion: there will only be one RNDF for one event, and it'll be available well ahead of time.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

DaveB — Fri, 19 May 2006 08:00:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nibor, I'm not sure whether you want to know where DARPA got the idea to require full-size vehicles, or where the quote came from. If it's the latter, see the first bullet in Section 2.2 of the PIP (Proposer Information Pamphlet for Track A). If it's the former, maybe they're hoping for designs that can readily be backfit into a full size vehicle, and trying to prevent teams from wasting resources designing something that already exists. Maybe they also think an ATV would have an unfair advantage staying within the lanes in city traffic, and/or be harder for the others to "see".

I suspect any "dune buggy" that made the trials last year would be considered as meeting the "proven safety record", if it meets the 72 inch, 2000 lb, criteria (or were modified to meet them), but suggest the team ask DARPA before investing much effort in that vehicle.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nibor — Fri, 19 May 2006 07:58:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Since were dealing with Track B it would seem the rules draft of 5/19/06 conflict with the Track A PIP. This appears to be true but the final event has both Track A and B competing on "equal footing" which is worrysome. We happen to have a "surplus" vehicle specifically designed and built for GC06 that can be modified to meet Urban07 draft rules. I feel an e-mail to DARPA coming on.

Looking to join team in the bay area

ofer — Fri, 19 May 2006 05:40:00 GMT

Posted by: ofer to Teaming:Looking to join team in the bay area

I emailed them, they're not going to compete this time =(

RNDF and MDF?

wolfbob — Fri, 19 May 2006 04:40:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

I won't be at the conf..

You might inquire as to why they are going to release the RNDF before the event. To what possible reason? It will only lead to semi's full of what-if grad students.

WBob

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

wolfbob — Thu, 18 May 2006 12:10:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Mike... thanx for the finger point...however for those that are not interested in Track A and didn't think to look there, the URL for the PIP is below.
http://fs2.fbo.gov/EPSData/ODA/Synopses/4 965/BAA06-36/urban_challenge_pip.pdf

Apparently there are no rules forTrackB :-)

WBob

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

DaveB — Thu, 18 May 2006 10:54:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Seems like DARPA needs to revise the last paragraph of Rules section 3.5, which includes this sentence, "Team activities to discover or exploit information about the course that is not openly available by pre-running or any other means may result in disqualification." They must have intended the "or by any other means" to mean other activities to discover information about the course are prohibited, but I can't parse the sentence to get that meaning. That phrase should be deleted.

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Thu, 18 May 2006 10:40:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

The only definite thing I can see is that the RNDF has to be available before the MDF can be processed, because the MDF is tied to a specfic RNDF.

Perhaps at a competition there will be multiple RNDFs available, and the bot has to choose the one that is specified in the MDF that gets actually loaded in. That gives five minutes to activate the specific RNDF and have it start feeding info to process the MDF.

Greater Autonomy

wolfbob — Thu, 18 May 2006 10:28:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Greater Autonomy

I don't quite get it.....

I think that you are given a chunk of city, say a mile square with roads, checkpoints, stop signs, parking lots etc all defined in GPS map coordinates. You are also give a number of missions that are checkpoints in an order and speeds designed to begin and end at the city boundry. Once you have completed a mission, you vehicle is turned back over to the team and you can put air in the tires and wash the windshield and drive it to the entry point for the next mission. This process continues for 60 miles or 6 hours.

Are there some 20-40 vehicles all flailing around inside of this "city" at the same time and are they going to be the moving targets you are to avoid running into? Who wins when some defective runs into your perfect vehicle and you are retired? beginning to look like Terramax is a good idea. (think battlebots).

I thot sommore and with 30 ft roads spaced at 100ft you would have around 100 miles bidirectional roads in my mile square grid. With 40 cars evenly spread out over 200 miles there would be 10 cars going in each of 4 directions. The 10 coming at you are spread over 50 roads so they are not a big deal. The 20 going across your direction are distributed over 2500 intersections so you would never see them...etc...not an issue. just how big is this city going to be???

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

mjg — Thu, 18 May 2006 09:51:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

wolfbob

My guess is that others obtained the above info the same way i did -- by going to the TrackA site (which initially at least was better populated).
In particular the grand_challenge_pip.pdf (pip = Proposer Information Pamphlet). The "Rules" have also been posted and both of these sources can be viewed/downloaded by initially going to www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/ and following the appropriate links.

Hope this was useful

Mike Gayle -- Base17

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nibor — Thu, 18 May 2006 08:33:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

"Vehicle must be built upon a full-size stock chassis or have a documented safety record. Vehicles smaller than a midsize commercial automobile do not meet this requirement. Golf cart-type or all terrain vehicles (ATVs) do not meet this requirement."

Just curious where this rule came from? All I saw was a min 72 inch wheel base x 9 ft x 9 ft max with 2000 to 30000 weight spread.

Webcast

Steve — Thu, 18 May 2006 06:30:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:Webcast

I do not exactly know what went wrong, but it did work at one time. It seemed to stop working (specifically the test your browser site) when they added the captions option on how to view the webcast. It does appear that the webcast option does still work, but there is nothing there, of course. I assume they will fix the test your browser option tonight.

Webcast

Ivar Schoenmeyr — Thu, 18 May 2006 05:25:00 GMT

Posted by: Ivar Schoenmeyr to Miscellaneous:Webcast

Tried to access the webcast site and get an error message.

Error Occurred While Processing Request

Variable CAPTIONS is undefined.

The error occurred in D:\Inetpub\tvworldwide\html\globe_show\da rpa\video.cfm: line 1

1 : <cfif captions EQ 1>
2 : <cfinclude template="video_wm_with_captions.cfm ">
3 : <cfelse>
Any idea what is going on?
Ivar (team CyberRider

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

wolfbob — Thu, 18 May 2006 01:50:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson..

Where did you get these rules??

WB

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

wolfbob — Thu, 18 May 2006 01:19:00 GMT

Posted by: wolfbob to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Ok now we got rules...lots of rules.

I dunno about other states but Cal is a real sticker on crossing double yellow lines for any reason except to enter driveways or under direction of a badged law person.This includes passing, U-turns or avoiding obsticles. I hope DARPA appreciates this and doesn't trap a 15ton mammoth somewhere. I guess you could back out...

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Diana — Wed, 17 May 2006 04:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Diana to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Yes!! Thanks so much for the quick reply!

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Diana — Wed, 17 May 2006 02:38:00 GMT

Posted by: Diana to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

LeenSTL — Wed, 17 May 2006 02:20:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

According to the rules, it will be sufficient to use the RNDF for determining stop sign locations, otherwise the rules would not specifically exclude traffic signal and stop sign recognition by use of sensors. Is that what you were asking?

Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

Applanix — Tue, 16 May 2006 10:19:00 GMT

Posted by: Applanix to Vendor/Suppliers:Applanix - Commercial Off The Shelf INS/GPS Navigation For Autonomous Vehicles

POS LV is a compact, fully integrated, turnkey position and orientation system, utilizing integrated inertial technology to generate stable, reliable and repeatable positioning solutions for land-based autonomous vehicle applications. Designed to operate under the most difficult GPS conditions found in urban and suburban environments, POS LV enables accurate positioning for autonomous vehicles and vehicle dynamics.

Generates continuous, accurate, position and orientation information under the most difficult GPS conditions
Produces precise, high-rate, low-latency, real-time data
Allows quick operational capability, with installation, calibration and training completed in as little as three days
Includes an automatic redundant data logging capability
Uses the latest survey-grade GPS technology for improved positioning performance

For more information about POS LV, contact Louis Nastro at:
lnastro@applanix.com
(905) 709-4600 x 482

For detailed product information and technical / white papers please visit:
http://www.applanix.com/products/poslv_ar ticles.php

[Edited on 5/16/2006]

Looking for a team - Image Processing

arturomdn — Tue, 16 May 2006 07:50:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

Hi Bren - I'd like to learn more "art at austinrobot dot com"

Sample RNDF Map Question

Patriot Robots — Tue, 16 May 2006 06:12:00 GMT

Posted by: Patriot Robots to Miscellaneous:Sample RNDF Map Question

Greetings,

I've been studying the RNDF example map and was wondering if anybody else had this question about line segment #2: Waypoint 2.1.2 is checkpoint 7. Waypoint 2.1.3 is around the corner of an intersection. I don't see any GPS data for that intersection--which is fine. No stop sign. Fine. We'll just have to determine that there IS an intersection and turn right. Here's where my question starts:

Assuming that Waypoint 2.1.3 is blocked and my vehicle cannot proceed, the robot will have to make a U-turn, go back to the intersection, and then what, proceed north on that undocumented road in the map until the robot reacquires the path toward waypoint 2.1.5 skipping 2.1.3 and 2.1.4? Furthermore, according to the RNDF, the segment is defined as one-way. Does this suggest we will never have an obstruction that will force us to calculate an alternate path within a one-way road?

--Ray

TrackB Video

mjg — Mon, 15 May 2006 09:40:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

Thank You.

I saw the schedule also, and came to the same conclusion (ie. answer to my own question --> probably 2007-04-13). Assuming of course a mapping back to 2005 DGC is reasonable.

Looking for a team - Image Processing

Bren — Mon, 15 May 2006 03:01:00 GMT

Posted by: Bren to Teaming:Looking for a team - Image Processing

I'm looking for a team that needs someone for image processing. I'm a Computer Scientist for the Electronic Proving Grounds out of Ft. Hood. I also have a strong background in Aerospace and Mechanical engineering. I have a startup company specializing in robotic vision applications and wanted to see if perhaps these technologies could be put to good use as well as have some fun.

Thanks,

Bren

TrackB Video

arturomdn — Mon, 15 May 2006 01:06:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

The master schedule was released

http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/docs/ Urban_Challenge_Master_Schedule.pdf

The video was Part 4 of a five part application for the 2005 DGC.
The Urban Challenge schedule gives the dates for Application Parts 1-4
for Track B, but does not indicate which part is the video, it is probably
either Part 3 (due March 2, 2007) or Part 4 (due April 13, 2007).

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 14 May 2006 11:55:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Yes, I would be interested in knowing how I can help.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldiers lives.
390 4Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Looking for Team in WA State

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 14 May 2006 11:51:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for Team in WA State

I worked for Ford's steamship division and have a team here in Traverse City, MI. I have worked at the Navy's Mobile-Robotics Laboartory http://www.nosc.mil/robots and have worked on the DARPA Grand Challenge for nearly five years now. Robots I have worked on are already in the field with US troops. If you want to get involved - joining my team is a very good way.

We are preparing three vehicles for the Urban Driving Challenge: AV ANDREA MORGAN - VW dune buggy; AV SYDNEY BRISTOW eight wheel drive four wheel steer US Army truck made by TATRA All Terrain Vehicles Inc; AV WENDY DARLING 2.5T US Army Cargo Truck.

We have a team of fundraising people working for us who have signed up Gates Rubber, TATRA All Terrain Vehicles Inc., National Instruments, and NeuroDimensions and others sponsors.

We have a contract to produce guidance systems for trucks as an aftermarket product.

Come up to TC for a shop visit, drive the eight wheel drive four wheel steer TATRA truck around in our sand lot and see our seven bay workshop.

Join our team; make a difference.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldiers lives.
390 4Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 14 May 2006 11:28:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Looking to join a team

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 14 May 2006 11:09:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking to join a team

Attachments:

DSC02697.JPG (2140Kb)

Looking to get involved

pgrayson@aimagic.org — Sun, 14 May 2006 10:28:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@aimagic.org to Teaming:Looking to get involved

Terpstarnix,

I worked for Ford's steamship division and have a team here in Traverse City, MI. I have worked at the Navy's Mobile-Robotics Laboartory http://www.nosc.mil/robots and have worked on the DARPA Grand Challenge for nearly five years now. Robots I have worked on are already in the field with US troops. If you want to get involved - joining my team is a very good way.

We are preparing three vehicles for the Urban Driving Challenge: AV ANDREA MORGAN - a classice VW dune buggy; AV SYDNEY BRISTOW an eight wheel drive four wheel steer US Armycargo truck made by TATRA All Terrain Vehicles Inc; and AV WENDY DARLING a classic Deuce And A Half US Army Cargo Truck.

We have a team of fundraising people working for us who have signed up Gates Rubber, TATRA All Terrain Vehicles Inc., National Instruments, and NeuroDimensions and others sponsors.

We have a contract to produce guidance systems for trucks as an aftermarket product.

Come up to TC for a shop visit, drive the eight wheel drive four wheel steer TATRA truck around in our sand lot and see our seven bay workshop.

Join our team; make a difference.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldiers lives.
390 4Mile Rd. S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
pgrayson@aimagic.org
http://aimagic.org

[Edited on 5/14/2006]

Attachments:

DSC02718.JPG (2256Kb)

Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Sparky — Sun, 14 May 2006 09:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Teaming:Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Paul-

I think you need to back up your claims. Please explain why none of your vehicles were selected for even a site visit for the 2005 GC. If there is a good reason, please say it here. Otherwise, I think people should be aware of what they might be getting in to.

TrackB Video

mjg — Fri, 12 May 2006 12:36:00 GMT

Posted by: mjg to Qualification Process:TrackB Video

TrackB Question

When is the Video due? Seems unlikely/difficult that it would due at the same time as the App(10-5-06 i believe). If it follows the pattern of the previous competition, it would be in Feb or Mar of 07.

thanks

Mike Gayle (team Base17 (new team, experienced people))

p.s. This whole project is going to be so much fun!

RNDF and MDF?

Steve — Fri, 12 May 2006 09:23:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

Time to check the rules. Definitions for the RNDF and MDF are now posted (not that they cannot be changed, but this is probably a good starting point).

My question has been (and this will probably be answered at the conference), "It is clear that the MDF is only given 5 minutes before the attempt, But when is the RNDF given?" In my opinion it should be at the same time, but they may give it out sooner. If they do give it out earlier, then teams could possibly "scope out" the course in advance.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

www.TeamProdigies.com — Fri, 12 May 2006 03:25:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

If any of you who are going to the competitor's conference read this and happen to agree with me on these points, I urge you to bring the issues up at the conference!

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

www.TeamProdigies.com — Fri, 12 May 2006 03:23:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Hmm yeah. I don't like any of those. Except the USB flash drive. I approve of that. As for the vehicle requirements, however, I am currently building myself an electric car just to drive between home, my highschool, and the local community college. I was planning on using this vehicle as my Urban Challenge entry chassis, but I was also planning on building it to be a two-seater car considerably smaller than a mid-size commercial automobile. Maybe somewhere around the size of an MG Midget. If you've seen one of those cars you know what I'm talking about.

Recognition of traffic lights and stop signs through the use of sensors is not only child's play in comparison to the grand scheme of this competition, but in my opinion it should most certainly be included in the rules. If the vehicles are supposed to obey traffic laws, then traffic-light and stop-sign recognition should certainly be "withinin the scope of this program". DARPA is once again pointing the rules towards dead-reckoning, GPS following vehicles not truly capable of responding to their environment in practical situations.

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson Bridwell — Fri, 12 May 2006 02:07:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

I can entirely sympathize with your viewpoint.

However, because DARPA is organizing, paying for, and putting their name on this competition, they also have the right to ask for what they want and need, rather than what you would like to provide. One practical consideration is that they need good press, and it doesn't take a genius to realize that they would be the subject of laughter and ridicule if a team decided to submit an autonomous skateboard, even if it could pass the other technical requirements.

But there is absolutely no reason why you can't organize a simple (non-DARPA) event that is open to smaller vehicles. That would give you an opportunity to prove your assertions. If you keep it simple and eliminate all the non-vital overhead and expenses, you will be able to pull it off. There are lots of previous DARPA teams with small vehicles that would make idea candidates.

I would check to see if you could affiliate it with the SAE - The Society of Automotive Engineers: www.sae.org They are very into automotive technology and quite keen to promote student interest.

Also, you might want to look into the annual Intelligent Ground Vehicle Competition, which is geared to teams of engineering students from universities: www.igvc.org/deploy/

Very best of luck!

[Edited on 5/12/2006]

RNDF and MDF?

DaveB — Thu, 11 May 2006 10:34:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

Since the RNDF will provide "GPS coordinates of the stop signs", lane width, and lane markings, my first guess is that it will include a detailed set of waypoints (with a waypoint at each segment of each radiused corner, at each change of lane width or lane marking, and at each intersection), plus a separate leg info section providing the lane marking and width and stopsign info in each direction between all connected waypoints. My second guess is that it will contain only a single section, providing the same leg info, plus coordinats of each end of the leg, leaving it up to your system to figure out where the roads connect by matching waypoint coordinates. Since stop sign info will be in GPS coordinates, I'll bet that all waypoint info will be in Lat/lon format, rather than, say, UTM, or State Coordinates.

By the way, LeenStl, your recollection of the load time for the MDF is off. The PIP, section 2.3, first bullet, states, "The vehicle will have 5 minutes to process a mission description before attempting the course." (it's also in the first bullet of Article III)

Greater Autonomy

Nelson Bridwell — Thu, 11 May 2006 08:21:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Greater Autonomy

"To complete the requirements for the Urban Challenge, each vehicle will complete multiple missions over a defined route network. The route network definition specifies accessible roads and all areas in which the vehicle may travel. A mission is a series of checkpoint locations that must be passed over sequentially by the vehicle. The path between checkpoints is not specified."

"DARPA will provide the Route Network Definition File (RNDF) that includes all accessible road segments and provides information such as waypoints, stop sign locations, lane widths, checkpoint locations, and parking spot locations. The route network has no implied start or end points. Road blockages will not be indicated in the RNDF."

"DARPA will also provide a Mission Data File (MDF) containing the checkpoints that must be reached and maximum and minimum speed limits for the road segments. MDFs will be provided by DARPA for all Urban Challenge test events."

So it sounds like the vehicles will be demonstrating greater autonomy and should be capable of greater flexibility in carrying out missions.

[Edited on 5/11/2006]

Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

Nelson Bridwell — Thu, 11 May 2006 08:18:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Rules:Some interesting points about the 2007 Urban Challenge

"Vehicle must be built upon a full-size stock chassis or have a documented safety record. Vehicles smaller than a midsize commercial automobile do not meet this requirement. Golf cart-type or all terrain vehicles (ATVs) do not meet this requirement."
No more GhostRiders, CyberRiders, or golf carts!

"Vehicle must be capable of loading a mission description file via a standard USB 2.0 flash drive." "The vehicle will have 5 minutes to process a mission description before attempting the course."
No more marathon pre-race micromanagement in the planning trailer by a herd of grad students!

"The following behaviors or capabilities are outside the scope of this program: Recognition of external traffic signals such as traffic lights and stop signs through the use of sensors. The Urban Challenge route network definition file will include information such as stop sign locations, nominal lane width, lane markings, and parking spot locations."
It might be possible to accomplish with minimal (if any) vision processing.

Looking to join team in the bay area

LeenSTL — Thu, 11 May 2006 03:38:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Teaming:Looking to join team in the bay area

Team Overbot is in the bay area, is Redwood City close enough? They got to the semi-finals in GC2005, take a look at www.overbot.com ...

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Thu, 11 May 2006 03:28:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

That's why I should cut & paste instead of trying to remember, thanks.

The GIS guy I spoke with about this said that he thought of the processing cycle as tied to an embedded GIS server, ie, the MDF file indicates that the bot should go a certain spot and the GIS engine would choose a route from among the various choices defined in the route network definitions. I'm not sure that a graphical GIS package can become an embedded socket based GIS server. Hopefully the eventual release of the file formats etc will help to clear things up.

How to do the Urban Challenge

John Nagle — Wed, 10 May 2006 11:17:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

Sure. See Proc. SPIE 2001, "Eye-safe laser radar imaging, R. Stettner, Advanced Scientific Concepts, Inc.", for the paper. Advanced Scientific Concepts is in Santa Barbara CA, and will sell prototype units for about $100K.

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Nibor — Wed, 10 May 2006 07:26:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

AC, me thinks all will be revealed on the 20th or at least enough to start the e-mails. Unless everything changed, teams will require at lease 1 human or facsimle up to some of the unversity teams consisting of 3 or 4 graduating classes. :)) What little I've been able to learn from the good DARPA folks it will be distance/time again, traffic merging, navigating a round-about (I'm from the southwest - don't need no stinkin round-about), and something about obeying traffic rules. If that means a motorcycle cop one of the guys here came up with some novell solutions involving roofing tacks and used motor oil but likely will involve something like T intersection stops and or signals plus head scratchers DARPA comes up with.

How to do the Urban Challenge

acgourley — Wed, 10 May 2006 04:27:00 GMT

Posted by: acgourley to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

Do you have any pointers on the flash lidar? I read what you said about it in the tech paper, and at the time when i searched for it I only got information on a very short range, cheap model.

Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Bob H — Wed, 10 May 2006 03:11:00 GMT

Posted by: Bob H to Teaming:Chicago Area Urban Challenge Team being assembled

Chicago area team being assembled to win The Urban Challenge. See the attached file for some positions where brain power is needed.
Part time is fine.
You do not have to be physically located in Chicago to be involved, just your heart, soul and brain power are required. Post your reply or call Bob Hamilton at 773.865.4225 or email at rahamilton@ameritech.net

[Edited on 5/20/2006]

Attachments:

Chicago Grand Challenge 3 team.doc (24Kb)

RNDF and MDF?

LeenSTL — Wed, 10 May 2006 02:32:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

I've heard from a GIS specialist that the RNDF sounds like a GIS
definitions file, and the MDF sounds like the actual set of checkpoints
to be followed. The rules make reference to the requirement that the robot must load
these from a flash drive and be ready to roll in five minutes, perhaps
that is to prevent teams from gaming the routes as was possible and
permissible for GC2004 & GC2005?

Will an embedded GIS will be needed for the urban challenge?

[Edited on 5/11/2006]

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Bill — Tue, 09 May 2006 07:57:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

The concept would work fine, it is done in factory automation a lot. Upgrades always seem to be done by another company. The only block is in the beginning having everyone agree on the inter-communications type and protocol.
Of course final test usually leads to some "not my equipment problem".

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

acgourley — Tue, 09 May 2006 04:55:00 GMT

Posted by: acgourley to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

I've often thought about this as well, it just makes good sense. However, I can also see how there would be a lot of problems and disagreements about design - the ideal software is often very dependant on the hardware. If you created a incredibly well designed and modular enough system, though, I could see there being hope.

I wish luck to anyone who wants to spearhead it. I would consider using it for my team and contributing back to it if it was done well.

Looking to get involved

acgourley — Tue, 09 May 2006 04:50:00 GMT

Posted by: acgourley to Teaming:Looking to get involved

Where are you located? The UC Davis grand challenge team would be happy to have you. You can contact me at acgourley # ucdavis % edu

Is anybody there?

LeenSTL — Tue, 09 May 2006 03:26:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

I've been thinking about a simulation, perhaps the ten second guideline could be applied to objects which are detected some distance away. If the object would not arrive within ten seconds then it could be ignored, however if it would arrive within ten seconds then it could not be ignored. I'm sure this gets more complex when both the simulated vehicle and the objects are moving towards each other.

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

arturomdn — Tue, 09 May 2006 02:44:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Here's some links that may be useful to someone thinking about Open Source for the Grand Challenge:

http://www.edn.com/article/CA6288032.html

The Player/Stage Project: Free Software tools for robot and sensor applications

http://grandchallenge.caltech.edu/wiki/in dex.php/Project_Papers

http://www.ai.sri.com/pubs/files/1221.pdf

http://playerstage.sourceforge.net/

JAUS (Joint Architecture for Unmanned Ground Systems)

http://www.answers.com/topic/jaus

http://www.jauswg.org/

http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge05/Tec hPapers/teamcimar.pdf

Participant's Conference Attendance

arturomdn — Tue, 09 May 2006 02:10:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Participant's Conference Attendance

I'll be there representing Austin Robot Technology.

Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Jon — Mon, 08 May 2006 12:37:00 GMT

Posted by: Jon to Teaming:Looking for a team in the Phoenix/Tuscon area

Howdy,

I'm an Aerospace engineer moving to Tuscon here in about a month. I did some graduate work in robotics, and the stuff is hugely interesting to me. I like to make things work, so I figure hey, what the heck. I have a background in guidance/controls and a pretty strong software background, so if anyone knows of a group in the Phoenix/Tuscon general Arizona area that is going to pursue the challenge and needs help in such areas, I would be interested in speaking with them.

Thanks,

-Jon

[Edited on 5/8/2006]

Participant's Conference Attendance

TAS — Mon, 08 May 2006 11:18:00 GMT

Posted by: TAS to Miscellaneous:Participant's Conference Attendance

Welcome back everyone! =)

Are any of you planning on attending the upcoming participant's conference in Virginia? (I was, to be honest, a bit surprised at the short notice) Also, are any local teams planning an informal get-together similar to what was put together by Team Cyberrider last year?

Best wishes to all of you and I look forward to seeing you soon!

[Edited on 5/8/2006]

RNDF and MDF?

DaveB — Mon, 08 May 2006 08:49:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

dszuza, guessing from the last two Challenges, the first appearance of the file format will be in the Rules, which have yet to be published (see Rules button on the home page). Also I think I recall that the file format for the first Challenge changed, slightly, a couple of times, in the early stages of development. DARPA had invited comments on the rules for that Challenge, and may do so again, for this one, since it's a whole new ballgame.

Dave B

Looking to join a team

S.L. Barth — Mon, 08 May 2006 07:56:00 GMT

Posted by: S.L. Barth to Teaming:Looking to join a team

I am looking to join a team. Unfortunately, I will not be able to visit the conference, since I'm in a play that day.

I have college degrees in Computer Science and Artificial Intelligence, and am currently employed as a software engineer and technical consultant. I would like to help out on the programming.

I live in Amersfoort, in the Netherlands. Visiting the USA won't be a problem.

S.L. Barth

Is anybody there?

Lantern — Mon, 08 May 2006 06:45:00 GMT

Posted by: Lantern to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

LeenSTL: Thanks for clearing that up. Now I wonder why the moderator would do that? Also, I still wonder how the teams are going to do field testing? Maybe the new traffic-capable robots can be simulated on a computer and won't need to go around bumping into things. Anyone going to the Participants Conference on May 20, 2006?

Is anybody there?

LeenSTL — Sun, 07 May 2006 11:50:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Lantern, you might see that Moderator posted lots of those messages in the suppliers area. Last time I called some of the suppliers and they were surprised to find themselves listed as Grand Challenge suppliers. These are often vendors that DARPA has dealt with in other projects, they might not have even heard of another Grand Challenge being held.

Is anybody there?

www.TeamProdigies.com — Sun, 07 May 2006 05:00:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

I'm here. (Nic Hoza from The Prodigies)

Looking for Team in WA State

www.TeamProdigies.com — Sun, 07 May 2006 04:57:00 GMT

Posted by: www.TeamProdigies.com to Teaming:Looking for Team in WA State

We'll be back for the Urban Challenge. You can check out our (un-updated) website at http://www.teamprodigies.com. We're located in Olympia/Tacoma.

Is anybody there?

Lantern — Sun, 07 May 2006 02:50:00 GMT

Posted by: Lantern to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Did anyone notice the "Suppliers" topic? (245) posts as of this date ! What does that mean?...245!! Does this mean American industry is alive and well/? Yankee traders. Looking for business, big time? We haven't even invented the thing yet and a supplier base already there. :)

Is anybody there?

Lantern — Sun, 07 May 2006 02:33:00 GMT

Posted by: Lantern to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Mock urban area to have merging with Abrams tanks !? :) Just thinking, I wonder how the teams are going to develop their entries ? For the last race field trials were everything. But all they needed really was a vacant lot and some trash cans. Now the teams need movable obstacles. It is going to be fun.

Looking to join team in the bay area

ofer — Sun, 07 May 2006 01:57:00 GMT

Posted by: ofer to Teaming:Looking to join team in the bay area

Hello,
I'm a computer vision expert by education (and a friendly guy with cool hobbies including photograhy). I want to volunteer / work to build
a vehicle in the urban grand challenge.

My qualifications include the work I've done at the Computer Vision an Robotics
Research laboratory at the University
of California, San Diego. I've built vehicle counter and
blind spot vehicle detectors using cameras. I have a
good working knowledge of how to build in-car video capture systems as I aided
in constructing a system to capture 8 full frame NTSC streams simultaneously
with time stamping in a vehicle (along with CAN-bus and other information).

Since graduation, outside of work, I've been writing an open source GPS mapping
and navigation program using public domain data and have also been working on
building a custom car computer for my own car.

Please let me know of any opportunities in the San Francisco Bay Area

Is anybody there?

arturomdn — Fri, 05 May 2006 12:59:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Robots will merge with M1 Abrams tank traffic... :-)

A harder course.

John Nagle — Fri, 05 May 2006 12:23:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Technology:A harder course.

The SICK LMS is a huge pain to interface correctly, but once you understand its wierd I/O limitations, it's straightforward enough. Once we figured out how to operate it properly, we were consistently able to reset it from faulted states. (We also did have a solid state power relay so we could power-cycle it if necessary, with appropriate software support, but that turned out to be unnecessary).

If you don't want a "dazzle" or "dirt" shutdown, you can set Availability Mode 3. Or just reset the thing.

The main issue in talking to the thing at 500,000 baud is that its little 8-bit microprocessor can't actually receive that fast. You have to provide a specified time delay between each byte sent to the device. This is documented in the SICK manual, but it's not emphasized.

We had the thing connected to a Sealevel Ethernet to serial converter good for up to 1mb/s or so, which handled the input side nicely.

SICK really needs to put a more modern controller in that thing. The present electronics are a decade old.

But you're not going to win the Urban Challenge with SICK units. It's time to move up.

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Bob H — Fri, 05 May 2006 09:51:00 GMT

Posted by: Bob H to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

That's funny. That's also the program the people execute here in my neighborhood (Chicago). The other line of code goes something like: if (The Man) ACCELERATE else ACCELERATE

Valde Systems, Inc.

mlinder — Fri, 05 May 2006 01:57:00 GMT

Posted by: mlinder to Vendor/Suppliers:Valde Systems, Inc.

We have also recently introduced our stereo smart camera, which embedds our VS1501 stereo vision processor in the same enclosure as the two cameras, making a complete stereo vision system!

We will also soon be introducing an IP66 rated sealed pan and tilt unit that
can be mounted to the roof of a vehicle.

Is anybody there?

sapper023 — Thu, 04 May 2006 10:10:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

It is quite reasonable to have a robot respond faster to its enviorment than a human could in most situations the only exceptions might be where it is possible for a human predict an outcome a machine may not have a predictive model component for . I have observed that most human vehical drivers tend to exibit some characteristics of poor or forgotten training and poor awarness . Under the rules of this challenge there should be no problems from the robots , but a cop may want to pull over robots for impeeding the flow of traffic simply because they will be driving under the rules like such a flow impeeding traffic hazard as opposed to with the flow of traffic . Vehical driving is not exclusivly a go no-go decision matrix , driving has many linear characteristics all sorts of which are capable of being handeled by a machine better than many humans on the road .

ELROB 2006

LeenSTL — Thu, 04 May 2006 08:14:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:ELROB 2006

Take a look at ELROB 2006 - http://www.elrob2006.org/ - various scenarios such as urban, non-urban, and EOD. There will be a video link at the event, perhaps it will be viewable by the public also.

If anyone from an ELROB 2006 team has info about the event, especially the urban scenario aspect, please post here.

Is anybody there?

LeenSTL — Thu, 04 May 2006 05:57:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

For sure they will not put humans into close contact with robots (unless maybe the humans are driving huge trucks like Terramax and the bots are just cars!).

Is anybody there?

Lantern — Thu, 04 May 2006 05:28:00 GMT

Posted by: Lantern to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Yes, I re-read the Press Release and they did say, "a mock urban area". An area set-up like the qualification course at the California Speedway, I guess, only some kind of traffic simulation (without drivers?). Maybe pop-up, moving cardboard signs? Then again, they did say, "safe operation in "moving traffic" and, "merging into moving traffic". That is going to be some kind of a mock urban area.

thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Joaquin — Thu, 04 May 2006 04:01:00 GMT

Posted by: Joaquin to Teaming:thinking of putting together a team in Orange County/Southern California

Hi,
I know its a bit early to be asking around considering that DARPA hasn't even held the conference yet but I am thinking of putting together a team that will probably be based in or around Orange County, California. If anyone is interested please message me or email me at jgabriels@avengi.com. Also our website is www.avengi.com .

Thanks,
Joaquin

A harder course.

Nelson Bridwell — Thu, 04 May 2006 02:17:00 GMT

Posted by: Nelson Bridwell to Technology:A harder course.

The DARPA Grand Challenge is one of the VERY FEW competitions that has the potential to actually push the technological envelope and has resulted in some long-overdue technical progress in this field. Almost all other "ROBOT" competitions have almost nothing to do with robotics and are instead pep rallys for elementary or high school students.

As such, I hope that it will never be "dumbed down" (if you will please excuse the poor choice of words). I am entirely in favor of encouraging student interest in engineering and the sciences, particularly in the USA. But we also need competions for experienced engineers to push the state of the art. We have all been sitting around for far too many decades, wating for real robots to finally make an appearance.

Is anybody there?

Bill — Wed, 03 May 2006 11:46:00 GMT

Posted by: Bill to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

HAve you ever watched a major city. Bots can hardly do worse then humans.

Preferred Chassis Fabrication Inc/Scorpion Vehicles

preferredchassisfab — Wed, 03 May 2006 11:31:00 GMT

Posted by: preferredchassisfab to Vendor/Suppliers:Preferred Chassis Fabrication Inc/Scorpion Vehicles

Preferred Chassis Fabrication, Inc. is the licensed manufacturer and intellectual property rights owner of the Scorpion all-terrain vehicle. Preferred Chassis Fabrication has designed a drive by wire Scorpion that is capable of analog joy-stick or digital control.
For information contact;
Dwaine Jungen
Preferred Chassis Fabrication
5961 E 32nd Street
Tucson, AZ 85711
520-975-6498
dwaine@preferredchassis.com
www.scorpion4x4.com
www.scorpionvehicles.com

[Edited on 5/3/2006]

How to do the Urban Challenge

John Nagle — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:54:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

Once you have a decent world model, making driving decisions will be interesting. It's going to take more than the pure reactive models many teams used last time. Behavior amidst human traffic will require some development work, although much of that can be done in simulation. That's going to be fun to work on.

Then you'll need substantial test space, and you'll probably dent some vehicles trying to get traffic behavior right.

Still, I think DARPA set the bar to about the right height this time. Someone may win the first time, and someone will win the second time.

John Nagle
Team Overbot (2002-2005)

[Edited on 5/3/2006]

How to do the Urban Challenge

John Nagle — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:54:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

Sensing options that could work include vision (more on this later), multibeam LIDAR systems like Team DAD had last year, and flash LIDAR systems. I'd look at flash LIDARs; we saw a good one last year, but couldn't use it because it was DoD-funded and not available by the cutoff date for that. This time, there's no problem. Also, I expect Team DAD will be back. Their 60-beam LIDAR was a nice little gadget, collecting enough data for this year, but not rugged enough. They'll fix that.

On the vision front, cameras bring in enough data, but of course, object extraction from cameras is hard. That's the cutting-edtge R&D problem this time. Millimeter radar might also be useful, especially since you can scan electronically, cars are good targets, and you get range rate. Last time, radar wasn't all that useful because it's a poor terrain sensor, but this time, it will probably play a bigger role. Using a good radar as the primary sensor for other moving vehicles may be the easiest way to approach the problem, and I'm sure it will be tried.

The world model needs to encompass fixed and moving obstacles. And some of the fixed obstacles might change to moving ones, as a vehicle starts to move. That's an area of research that hasn't received enough attention.

A harder course.

Sparky — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:54:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Technology:A harder course.

Yes, there is an "availability" bit that can be changed in the configuration that will ignore the "dazzle" issue. Many teams didn't know about this until the NQE. You could look at the failure log to see what happened with the unit. One thing that does not get recorded is a failure due to high temperature. This was another reason for failure of some units. They worked fine after they cooled down, though.

How to do the Urban Challenge

John Nagle — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:53:00 GMT

Posted by: John Nagle to Technology:How to do the Urban Challenge

This looks difficult, but possible.

First, I'm assuming that everyone reading this understands how GC entries from last time around worked. If you don't, go read the tech papers.

Things are simpler than they were two years ago. You can buy many of the key components, including drive-by-wire vehicle controls and GPS/INS/magnetic compass/gycrocompass/odometer integration. Three years ago, you couldn't do that, which tied up much development time for the first teams. Now, you just throw money at the problem. About $100K gets you through that part. Get the good fibre optic gyro option; you'll lose GPS in urban environments all the time.

On the sensing side, we have some new challenges. Approaches based on line scanners (like the SICK units) probably aren't going to be enough this time. Approaches based on those mostly assume a static world. This time, vehicles will need to be able to handle both fixed and moving obstacles. The moving obstacles will have to be identified and their behavior modelled and predicted. Note the requirement of being able to merge into traffic and behave properly at intersections. That's the big challenge.

RNDF and MDF?

dszuza — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:38:00 GMT

Posted by: dszuza to Miscellaneous:RNDF and MDF?

Does anybody have the format of these files

RNDF = Route Network Definition File
MDF = Mission Data file

Looking to get involved

Terpstarnix — Wed, 03 May 2006 09:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Terpstarnix to Teaming:Looking to get involved

I'm looking to join a team. I work for Ford, but am looking to help out on a project in my free time. So any team that wants some free help, let me know.

[Edited on 5/3/2006]

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

DaveB — Wed, 03 May 2006 08:55:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Dan, Ivar Schoenmeyr, team CyberRider, tried coordinating the open source idea for the last challenge, but my impression is that he didn't get much response. Probably most teams don't want to share their best ideas and equipment.

His email address is available in last year's technical papers:
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge/techp apers.asp

(By the way, if you want to provided a longer note than this forum allows, you can just attach a file)

Track A

DaveB — Wed, 03 May 2006 08:34:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Rules:Track A

ptrep, sorry I'm not a lawyer, but as an engineer retired from a company working on DARPA and other military related jobs, my comments may help:

1. Don't expect a lawyer to sort it out. It's the engineers and administrators who must do it. Consult alawyer only for things you can't understand, and to review your submissions when complete. It's like doing taxes for the first time, read everything a couple times, then start plugging away and the questions will get answered as you go.

2. If you're not a company or school with a significant reputation, made at least the NQE last year, or already have a vehicle that can drive itself in town, it's unlikely you'll be selected for Track A. You've got to be able to convince DARPA that you CAN and WILL produce a vehicle that can complete the courses. The teams that finished the Grand Challenge have a good chance of selection. Everyone else has a long way to go, but the good news is you can always revert to Track B.

3. Don't be too upset by those clauses that require you to give up your technology. Federal law prohibits the government from requiring you to give them your existing technology in order to get a contract, and the PIP is clear on this. However, to keep your existing technology proprietary, you're going to have to declare, in your bid, exactly what you're keeping proprietary.

Is anybody there?

LeenSTL — Wed, 03 May 2006 05:32:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

There is mention of a "mock urban area" which would probably be built on a military area for testing, kind of like the mock towns etc built for military training. DARPA has enough smarts to realize that even the best behaved bot can go on a rampage ala Golem II which took off at high speed into the desert in the GC2005. That would be a recipe for disaster, having bots run wild in a public area.

Is anybody there?

Lantern — Wed, 03 May 2006 05:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Lantern to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Wow, I was flabergasted when I saw this site. I was amazed at Darpa for dreaming-up the "drive-in-traffic" idea. They must be out of their cotton-picking minds! How they going to drive in real live traffic? I hope it's no where near where I live.

Problem which ended your vehicles chance at NQE?

LeenSTL — Wed, 03 May 2006 04:42:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Miscellaneous:Problem which ended your vehicles chance at NQE?

There has been enough time since the NQE to talk about this now (I hope). I'm sure that emotions were high at the time since not qualifyng at the NQE must have been a kick in the rear. What conclusions have you come to about your 2005 team vehicle and why it could not qualify at NQE, and what will be needed to make it competitive in the Urban Challenge?

This time around, just getting to the NQE at least earns your team some bucks (for track B teams that is), qualifying earns more also. This helps to offset the costs of developing these hi-tech bots.

A harder course.

LeenSTL — Wed, 03 May 2006 04:34:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Technology:A harder course.

Don't give up yet! Isn't there some reset code that some of the teams used to reset their Sick Laser scanners when a reset was needed? I seem to remember reading about that in one of the teams blogs, maybe Cyberrider? They didn't know about it until after they discovered the problem at NQE.

I met one of the guys from your team on Sunday morning at the closing ceremony, I think he was able to get an airplane ride over the course on Saturday! Now that would have been cool, did he get any good video?

Also, the bot won't have to sense stop lights, right? Besides, those are easy: green go, red stop, yellow speed up.

[Edited on 5/3/2006]

Looking for Team in WA State

LeenSTL — Wed, 03 May 2006 04:05:00 GMT

Posted by: LeenSTL to Teaming:Looking for Team in WA State

Take a look at the teams that registered for GC2005 and see if any are in your area. I seem to recall there was a team that made it to the semi-finals, Team Wave perhaps?

At any rate, you'll find that teams begin forming after the conference, it's a bit early yet since the announcement just came out yesterday. You will probably see new teams forming for this challenge, although conventional wisdom says that teams with pre-existing vehicles have a huge lead. If that were true then CMU would have won GC2005.

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

ACfishing — Wed, 03 May 2006 03:55:00 GMT

Posted by: ACfishing to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

And... have they come up with ofificial rules? Like all the things your 'bot will have to do?

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

ACfishing — Wed, 03 May 2006 03:53:00 GMT

Posted by: ACfishing to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Well, some more questions now:
Where will it be held?
How many people must be in a team?

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

danda — Wed, 03 May 2006 02:17:00 GMT

Posted by: danda to Teaming:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Cross posting this here, from the technology section.

----

Hi, my name is Dan Libby.

I would like to solicit feedback on the idea of creating an open source project to build re-usable components for automated cars, that could be shared between teams.

Likely it has already been discussed, but hey -- I'm new here, so maybe you'll indulge me and tell me why it is a crazy idea, won't work, or is against the rules, or whatever. Or just *maybe* you'll volunteer to help out.

Anyway, please read my preliminary post on the topic here:

http://dandaddl.livejournal.com/2006/05/0 2/

Regards,

Dan

[Edited on 5/3/2006]

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

danda — Wed, 03 May 2006 01:12:00 GMT

Posted by: danda to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Thanks for the info Dave. I'll contact Ivar and see what happened.

It would be a pity if no one wants to cooperate. Clearly there are areas of commonality that could be shared between teams, yet still leaving lots of room for proprietary algorithm additions and tweaks, for that winning edge.

I think this is too important to keep all the code locked away. If even just one team with a plausible entry in last year's event would be willing to donate some (or all) of their code, that would be a great seed for a FOSS project.

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Nibor — Tue, 02 May 2006 11:14:00 GMT

Posted by: Nibor to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Tis official. The good news is they are spreading out the money. Some of the requirements are going to be tough like traffic merging. I haven't figured out how to do that with the family car yet??? One solution might be a 32,0000 pound truck and 1 line of code: if (TrafficClear) MERGE else MERGE :))) next problem please!

Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

danda — Tue, 02 May 2006 08:42:00 GMT

Posted by: danda to Technology:Where's the Open Source Grand Challenge Entry?

Hi, my name is Dan Libby.

I would like to solicit feedback on the idea of creating an open source project to build re-usable components for automated cars, that could be shared between teams.

Likely it has already been discussed, but hey -- I'm new here, so maybe you'll indulge me and tell me why it is a crazy idea, won't work, or is against the rules, or whatever. Or just *maybe* you'll volunteer to help out.

Anyway, please read my preliminary post on the topic here:

http://dandaddl.livejournal.com/2006/05/0 2/

Regards,

Dan

Looking for Team in WA State

Monikka — Tue, 02 May 2006 06:06:00 GMT

Posted by: Monikka to Teaming:Looking for Team in WA State

Does anyone have an idea how I can find out if there is a team in Western Washington State? I'm a Mechanical Engineer at Intel and I'd love to get involved with a team in the area.

Thanks

when where and how?

Loredo Rucchin — Tue, 02 May 2006 06:00:00 GMT

Posted by: Loredo Rucchin to Qualification Process:when where and how?

when where and how?

A harder course.

mike — Tue, 02 May 2006 05:01:00 GMT

Posted by: mike to Technology:A harder course.

This third year of the Darpa Challenge is going to be tough[Image Removed]. I am on the Palos Verdes high school Road Warriors Team. We entered the challenge twice and now our equipment may not be able handle sensing parked cars, stop lights, and pedestrians. Our car is called the Doom Buggy and in the last challenge the sun blinded the lasers that we had and we crashed into a "Rent a Wreck" car that was possitioned outside the tunnel. If our car can not see a big ford mustang how will it be able to see people and traffic cones. I hope the course is not very hard (Even thought it will be) because or car needs more lasers and we will give it our best. I hope we get to try the course.

Is anybody there?

sapper023 — Mon, 01 May 2006 09:58:00 GMT

Posted by: sapper023 to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Yep cool .
I am on myspace.com/sapper023 so you can see how crazy I am .
So I will not be blogging here :)
nor will I be blogging there after this week of this edit for a while
careful about white on white
carefull about the white on white background .
this has potential , change is always interesting .

[Edited on 7/2/2006]

Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

DaveB — Mon, 01 May 2006 09:04:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Sponsors:Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

Seth, don't neglect to contact those vendors in the suppliers/vendors thread whose gear you're interested in. They should all be aware of the importance of this challenge (and it shouldn't hurt to contact any outside vendor whose equipment you like).

[Edited on 5/1/2006]

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

DaveB — Mon, 01 May 2006 08:39:00 GMT

Posted by: DaveB to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

AC, as of this afternoon, it's official. See
http://www.darpa.mil/grandchallenge

Track A

ptrep — Mon, 01 May 2006 08:27:00 GMT

Posted by: ptrep to Rules:Track A

Can anyone (preferably with a legal background) summarize the rules behind Track A in plain English? So far, Track A looks promising, but there is a ton of legal jargon that makes it look quite intimidating. Thanks.

Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

Seth — Mon, 01 May 2006 07:11:00 GMT

Posted by: Seth to Sponsors:Team LoGHIQ seeking sponsors

Hello,

Team LoGHIQ (DGC 2004) is looking for sponsors to provide money/components for our entry in the 2007 DGC. We have ad space available on our uniforms and vehicle. If interested please send me an e-mail at cabes@alum.rpi.edu. Thanks!

Seth Cabe
Team LoGHIQ

Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

ACfishing — Sat, 29 Apr 2006 07:16:00 GMT

Posted by: ACfishing to Urban Challenge Final Event:Is the Urban Challenge offcial???

Hi. I see the whole forum is dedicated to the "urban challenge". I knew DARPA was thinking about one, but is it really happenning? Where? The Grand Challenge Website is so wierd and hard to navigate. The link moves to all different things. If there is a new site please direct me.
Thanks,
AC

RoboRealm - Free Robotic Machine Vision Software

RoboRealm — Sat, 29 Apr 2006 03:13:00 GMT

Posted by: RoboRealm to Vendor/Suppliers:RoboRealm - Free Robotic Machine Vision Software

RoboRealm provides you with an interactive and experimentation vision
system to investigate the very complex world of image analysis and
image processing. Through an easy to use analysis pipeline you can add
image processing filters to translate an image into robotic movements,
computer actions, or just plain fun! RoboRealm is free to download!

Image and/or video processing can be technically difficult. Robots
are continuously moving towards high powered PC based systems that are
capable of supporting complex image processing functions. Sometimes you
just need a testbed of current image processing applications to test
potential ideas that you want your robot or computer+camera application
to perform. We've compiled several image processing functions into a
freely available windows based application that you can use with your
computer's webcam. You can use it to test out your vision ideas and see
what may be possible or not.

Free Robotic Machine Vision Software

Preliminary rules = CDL

Sparky — Fri, 28 Apr 2006 10:34:00 GMT

Posted by: Sparky to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

Paul-

How did your vehicles do in the last race? I couldn't find any updates on your website.

Is anybody there?

Mark — Fri, 28 Apr 2006 09:39:00 GMT

Posted by: Mark to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

I missed you guys!

[Edited on 4/28/2006]

Technical Writer writing about your team.

pgrayson@chartermi.net — Fri, 28 Apr 2006 06:29:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@chartermi.net to Media:Technical Writer writing about your team.

In addition to being team leader for AIM Racing, I am a free-lance technical writer.

Please put me on the distribution list for information you would like to see published.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@chartermi.net
http://aimagic.org

Preliminary rules = CDL

pgrayson@chartermi.net — Fri, 28 Apr 2006 06:22:00 GMT

Posted by: pgrayson@chartermi.net to Rules:Preliminary rules = CDL

My team is going on its fifth year now of working to promote the race, assist other teams, and outfit three vehicles of our own.
We are looking at having our driving system qualify for a CDL with air brakes endorsement.
Our newest sponsor TATRA All Terrain Trucks hope to make our system an after market option for thier line of trucks.
If you are looking for a team to join please consider joining my all-volunteer team. We could use your help.

Please note that my contact information has changed since the last race. We are now in a bigger workshop on the other side of town and my internet service provider has changed my e-mail address.

GO ROBOTS !
Embroidered team jacket patches are available for $5 each, get one today!
Team bumper stickers with our "Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives." slogan, $2 each.

Paul F. Grayson - Chief Engineer
AMERICAN INDUSTRIAL MAGIC, LLC
Racing to build technology that saves soldier's lives.
390 4 Mile Road S.
Traverse City, MI 49686-8411
(231) 946-0187
(231) 883-4463 cell
pgrayson@chartermi.net
http://aimagic.org

Attachments:

1077475825_tatra.jpg (19Kb)

Proof-2.JPG (378Kb)

tatra-dakar2.jpg (79Kb)

Is anybody there?

arturomdn — Fri, 28 Apr 2006 02:35:00 GMT

Posted by: arturomdn to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Ok, I'll be third :-)

Is anybody there?

UrbaneChallenger — Wed, 26 Apr 2006 11:50:00 GMT

Posted by: UrbaneChallenger to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

And someone has to second. Perhaps we'll take a vote and set the Urban Challenge in motion.

[Edited on 4/27/2006]

Is anybody there?

Steve — Wed, 26 Apr 2006 06:38:00 GMT

Posted by: Steve to Miscellaneous:Is anybody there?

Well, someone had to post first. So far so good. Looks like the site is coming on.

I assume many of old are still around?

ATV Corporation